The " Back up Plan"

[Fluffy]

I beg to differ,
Robbo was a nobody at Canberra
Matai came from Q Cup as a youngster
Wolfie was a nobody at Parra
Hall & Stranger were journeymen at best ( and kind of still are )
Bryant was a nobody
Ballin came from Q Cup I think ( not rated by the Broncs)
Orford was a Central Coast junior during the Beagles days that we let go to get Kimmorley and then got him back at three times the $$ that he left on.

Targeted recruiting v development
I'd say we developed 6 out of those 8 ( and put the polish on Hall and Stranger )

Drawing a long bow on some of them
Orford was a marquee signing that had more drama than DCE surrounding it, only that we got the signature. Prior to that he was not close to first grade at Manly.


Ballin, Matai and Wolfman are definately developed by us.

The rest by others

The simple way is where did they debut

 

[Fluffy]

He's definitely improved for sure.

I must be missing something

Friday was about as good as he has played since leaving and he was average at best.

Made just 73m from 10 hitups and 18 tackles, first half was 46m from 7 hitups so 6.5m per hitup, not very effective at all. Chuck in his mandatory penalty and error.

He would be behind BJ, Starling, Mason and Burgess in our pack

 

[Kevinward777]

I must be missing something

Friday was about as good as he has played since leaving and he was average at best.

Made just 73m from 10 hitups and 18 tackles, first half was 46m from 7 hitups so 6.5m per hitup, not very effective at all. Chuck in his mandatory penalty and error.

He would be behind BJ, Starling, Mason and Burgess in our pack

Wow, i thought he did better than that. But you can't argue with stats.

 

[lurker]

Yeh I've never seen him as a bloke that can stand up and dominate. He's just a niggler. Goes ok when the pack is on the front foot. Can give away stupid penalities too

 

[Not Paul Kent]

Assuming Foran leaves and we have about $2 mil to play with, including 3rd party deals

The very first thing I'd do is re-sign Matty Ballin on a 2 year deal with the option for a 3rd.

I'd negotiate an immediate swap with the Titans, DCE for Elgey, the sooner Joey gets a hold of him the better, and Myles, he's matured with age, is as tough as they come and thrives under origin type intensity, I think he's the type of leader we need for the rest of this year and moving forward.

Pick up Maloney or Sezer on about 450K-550k if we can otherwise sign Cornish, would be nice to have a decent goal kicker in the side!

Then I'd throw the chequebook at Sam Burgess to come back from Union. He's a huge name and probably the best forward in the game. Good for the profile of the club both on and off the field.

Then I'd grab some impact players in Sam Thaiday who will also add more experience and bring a good attitude to the side, by all reports he's on the outs at the Broncos! And one of Mose Masoe or Sam Kasiano.

Then I'd use our 2nd tier cap to poach some of the best young players from other clubs and use NSW cup as virtually a development squad like the emerging blues type of set up. Parcell, Jayden Nikorima and Jo Ofengaue all come to mind.

Players not retained are Chee-Kam 250k, Dave Williams 150k, Willie Mason 200k, Sosaia Vave 100k, DCE 600k, Horo 250k, Hasson 100k, Berryman 100k and if need be Dunamis Lui would be squeezed out as well, although I'd prefer to keep him!

That would make our team

Stewart
Gutherson
Matai
Lyon
Hiku
Maloney/Cornish
Elgey
Myles
Ballin
Lawrence
Sam Thaiday
Jamie Buhrer
Sam Burgess

Feleti Mateo
Mose Masoe
Luke Burgess
Jake T

 

[lurker]

Assuming Foran leaves and we have about $2 mil to play with, including 3rd party deals

The very first thing I'd do is re-sign Matty Ballin on a 2 year deal with the option for a 3rd.

I'd negotiate an immediate swap with the Titans, DCE for Elgey, the sooner Joey gets a hold of him the better, and Myles, he's matured with age, is as tough as they come and thrives under origin type intensity, I think he's the type of leader we need for the rest of this year and moving forward.

Pick up Maloney on about 450K if we can otherwise sign Cornish, would be nice to have a decent goal kicker in the side!

Then I'd throw the chequebook at Sam Burgess to come back from Union. He's a huge name and probably the best forward in the game. Good for the profile of the club both on and off the field.

Then I'd grab some impact players in Sam Thaiday who will also add more experience and bring a good attitude to the side, by all reports he's on the outs at the Broncos! And one of Mose Masoe or Sam Kasiano.

Then I'd use our 2nd tier cap to poach some of the best young players from other clubs and use NSW cup as virtually a development squad like the emerging blues type of set up. Parcell, Jayden Nikorima and Jo Ofengaue all come to mind.

Players not retained are Chee-Kam 250k, Dave Williams 150k, Willie Mason 200k, Sosaia Vave 100k, DCE 600k, Horo 250k, Hasson 100k, Berryman 100k and if need be Dunamis Lui would be squeezed out as well, although I'd prefer to keep him!

That would make our team

Stewart
Gutherson
Matai
Lyon
Hiku
Maloney/Cornish
Elgey
Myles
Ballin
Lawrence
Sam Thaiday
Jamie Buhrer
Sam Burgess

Feleti Mateo
Mose Masoe
Luke Burgess
Jake T

Sam thaiday is rubbish and way over the hill. If you watched the broncs game the other name every time he makes contact with another player he falls on his stomach. No fighting through contact, no bending the line, no breaking tackles and a million stupid penalties.

No thanks. Old, overrated has been.

 

[lurker]

Assuming Foran leaves and we have about $2 mil to play with, including 3rd party deals

The very first thing I'd do is re-sign Matty Ballin on a 2 year deal with the option for a 3rd.

I'd negotiate an immediate swap with the Titans, DCE for Elgey, the sooner Joey gets a hold of him the better, and Myles, he's matured with age, is as tough as they come and thrives under origin type intensity, I think he's the type of leader we need for the rest of this year and moving forward.

Pick up Maloney or Sezer on about 450K-550k if we can otherwise sign Cornish, would be nice to have a decent goal kicker in the side!

Then I'd throw the chequebook at Sam Burgess to come back from Union. He's a huge name and probably the best forward in the game. Good for the profile of the club both on and off the field.

Then I'd grab some impact players in Sam Thaiday who will also add more experience and bring a good attitude to the side, by all reports he's on the outs at the Broncos! And one of Mose Masoe or Sam Kasiano.

Then I'd use our 2nd tier cap to poach some of the best young players from other clubs and use NSW cup as virtually a development squad like the emerging blues type of set up. Parcell, Jayden Nikorima and Jo Ofengaue all come to mind.

Players not retained are Chee-Kam 250k, Dave Williams 150k, Willie Mason 200k, Sosaia Vave 100k, DCE 600k, Horo 250k, Hasson 100k, Berryman 100k and if need be Dunamis Lui would be squeezed out as well, although I'd prefer to keep him!

That would make our team

Stewart
Gutherson
Matai
Lyon
Hiku
Maloney/Cornish
Elgey
Myles
Ballin
Lawrence
Sam Thaiday
Jamie Buhrer
Sam Burgess

Feleti Mateo
Mose Masoe
Luke Burgess
Jake T

also you've just removed all our depth. and the second tier cap isn't big enough to poach promising talent. Its only a couple of hundred k

 

[Loobs]

I think one of the big reasons we won in 2008 was a front row of Josh Perry and Brent Kite. Both players were bought from other clubs, and I think it's time Manly go searching for big powerful props in the market again.

I've come around to the idea of Lyon at 5/8 given the speed he appears to have lost, and move Hiku into the centres where he can be better utilised. Then we just need to keep Foran, and sign a young prospect like Elgey.

I don't think Sezer is the answer; he is a running 5/8 with a limited skill set. He'd be good outside a guy like DCE, but he is not the kind of player to steer a team around the park.

Sam thaiday is rubbish and way over the hill. If you watched the broncs game the other name every time he makes contact with another player he falls on his stomach. No fighting through contact, no bending the line, no breaking tackles and a million stupid penalties.

No thanks. Old, overrated has been.

Perfect 2016 Gold Coast Titan then...

I'd have a look at Kade Snowden and Korbin Sims. Both off contract, Sims only 23...

 

[lurker]

Perfect 2016 Gold Coast Titan then...

I'd have a look at Kade Snowden and Korbin Sims. Both off contract, Sims only 23...

kade snowden in the last few years has become a plonker. I used to rate him at Cronulla. Newcastle has killed his career

 

[lurker]

Perfect 2016 Gold Coast Titan then...

I'd have a look at Kade Snowden and Korbin Sims. Both off contract, Sims only 23...

For a depth guy I like Dayne Weston I think hes pretty underrated. I think if we chased both JWH and Napa we'd force the price up on the rooters and I reckon we could get one of them. Not a huge fan of napa but I'd like jwh back. I think sika manu would be a good pickup. I like a mongrel pack that people don't like to play. maybe kasiano but I don't think he's a starting front rower. Ultimately tom burgess is the pick of the free agent front rower class

 

[Loobs]

For a depth guy I like Dayne Weston I think hes pretty underrated. I think if we chased both JWH and Napa we'd force the price up on the rooters and I reckon we could get one of them. Not a huge fan of napa but I'd like jwh back. I think sika manu would be a good pickup. I like a mongrel pack that people don't like to play. maybe kasiano but I don't think he's a starting front rower. Ultimately tom burgess is the pick of the free agent front rower class

You saying guys like Feleti don't instill fear in the opposing pack..?

 

[lurker]

You saying guys like Feleti don't instill fear in the opposing pack..?

lol starling is the only real grub we have in our forward pack. He seems to have a punch me face. Blokes always wanna go him hahaha

 

[Kevinward777]

Tom Burgess and Mose Masoe will do nicely.

 

[Not Paul Kent]

also you've just removed all our depth. and the second tier cap isn't big enough to poach promising talent. Its only a couple of hundred k

I disagree that I've killed off our depth, With the above signings, would still have Starling, Sene Lefao, Symonds,Leary, Taufua, JLJ and Tom T in lower grades

 

[lurker]

I disagree that I've killed off our depth, With the above signings, would still have Starling, Sene Lefao, Symonds,Leary, Taufua, JLJ and Tom T in lower grades

i didn't even notice myles. my estimation is you've eaten about 8mil of a 6.5mil salary cap. Myles is the captain of the titans market value of at least 600-700k. burgess you'd be looking at 800k-1mil. kasiano about 500k. mose 300-400k. Maloney 500-600k. thaiday not that I think he's worth it but 500-600k. Plus you're going to have to re-up gutherson and the T's. Even if I take the low values the players you've just brought in are at least 3.2mil that's half the cap. while only removing 1mil (the halves) and about 1 mil in the other players. And you need to re up your young kids. It's not possible

 

[Not Paul Kent]

I agree With some of your points Lurker, but there would be third party stuff in there too particularly for a player like Burgess, I disagree with your valuations of Kasiano who isn't in hot demand probably closer to 350 than 500, and Mose probably close to the 250-300 mark. Gutherson won't command much of an increase, off such a serious knee injury I think your valuations of Myles and Thaiday are probably 150k over the mark, I also said Masoe OR Kasiano not both. I doubt Stewart will go around again in 2017 so there's 600k that can be used to upgrade the T's. I think that Foran and DCE would free up over a million, maybe one big name too many in Thaiday but I think it would go closer to fitting than you would think

 

[Not Paul Kent]

I agree With some of your points Lurker, but there would be third party stuff in there too particularly for a player like Burgess, I disagree with your valuations of Kasiano who isn't in hot demand probably closer to 350 than 500, and Mose probably close to the 250-300 mark. Gutherson won't command much of an increase, off such a serious knee injury I think your valuations of Myles and Thaiday are probably 150k over the mark, I also said Masoe OR Kasiano not both. I doubt Stewart will go around again in 2017 so there's 600k that can be used to upgrade the T's. I think that Foran and DCE would free up over a million, maybe one big name too many in Thaiday but I think it would go closer to fitting than you would think

1.15 mil conservative estimate of current halves contracts
1.35 mil other releases

2.5 mil to play with

Burgess 1mil (100 k at least 3rd party)
Elgey 200k
Myles 450k
Thaiday 400k
Masoe 300k
Maloney 500k

=2.85mil

I didn't cost the original plan so probably one player too many, flick Thaiday and it would definitely fit.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

The interesting thing with all this is there's a fair few off contract that are going to suit our needs, and many no where near as expensive as 2 Million plus for two players.

As I have said time and time again, paying 1.1 Million each for the two halves was always going to be a folly, I could never understand why we didn't pick one of the two, go hard and let the other go to the highest bidder,

That's sort of happened now and IF we already had the Fozzie signature we'd be talking about a young half to bring on and a good forward with the money saved.

Keep the ideas coming as its an interesting thread

 

[StuBoot]

Drawing a long bow on some of them
Orford was a marquee signing that had more drama than DCE surrounding it, only that we got the signature. Prior to that he was not close to first grade at Manly.


Ballin, Matai and Wolfman are definately developed by us.

The rest by others

The simple way is where did they debut

So the dozen or so games Orford played and made his debut for the Northern Eagles don't count?
True, he came back as a marquee signing but if we'd not signed Kimmorley ( for 3 x the price ) he wouldn't have gone anywhere.

* Apologies to thoset hat take offence that I refer NE as us - unfortunately that was just the way it was and they were the closest thing to MWSE that we had.

 

[pjayz]

I agree With some of your points Lurker, but there would be third party stuff in there too particularly for a player like Burgess, I disagree with your valuations of Kasiano who isn't in hot demand probably closer to 350 than 500, and Mose probably close to the 250-300 mark. Gutherson won't command much of an increase, off such a serious knee injury I think your valuations of Myles and Thaiday are probably 150k over the mark, I also said Masoe OR Kasiano not both. I doubt Stewart will go around again in 2017 so there's 600k that can be used to upgrade the T's. I think that Foran and DCE would free up over a million, maybe one big name too many in Thaiday but I think it would go closer to fitting than you would think

FYI: Dogs have offered Kasiano $550k per year for 3 years