Defence

[Snake]

A lot has been said about how poor we defended this year and of course you cannot argue that...but...I really think people might be underestimating the impact that losing Koroisau had on our season. I totally understand that we were already falling apart before he got injured but not to the extent that it fell apart when he went down.

I think Fainu is a fine prospect and did a better job than anyone could ask; this is in no way a criticism of his game. However, defending at 9 is the toughest job in RL and that is what separates the rookies from the seasoned first graders. It has nothing to do with creativity or service, that is another debate altogether. But the middle of the ruck has been loose for weeks because Api is probably in the top 3 defensive hookers in the game.

It has nothing to do with missed tackles or tackle counts either. It's everything to do with consistent line speed and chopping the player down, winning the ruck and getting up quickly at marker. These are not things that show up in statistics.

We couldn't cope with the opposition packs getting a roll on week in week out. We will be a much better side if he can play the bulk of 2019.

Whilst on the subject of next season, Manly need to buy two fast wingers.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

A lot has been said about how poor we defended this year and of course you cannot argue that...but...I really think people might be underestimating the impact that losing Koroisau had on our season. I totally understand that we were already falling apart before he got injured but not to the extent that it fell apart when he went down.

I think Fainu is a fine prospect and did a better job than anyone could ask; this is in no way a criticism of his game. However, defending at 9 is the toughest job in RL and that is what separates the rookies from the seasoned first graders. It has nothing to do with creativity or service, that is another debate altogether. But the middle of the ruck has been loose for weeks because Api is probably in the top 3 defensive hookers in the game. We couldn't cope with the opposition packs getting a roll on week in week out. We will be a much better side if he can play the bulk of 2019.

Whilst on the subject of next season, Manly need to buy two fast wingers.

Agree 110% on both points, AND a forward to replace Penny Lane!!

 

[Budgie]

Yep. Api huge defensive loss. But I did wonder quite often if the attacking heroics of Marty and AFB i\were in any way matched by their defensive efforts? Seemed a bit soft/sloppy to me.

 

[brad]

For sure we missed him massively around the ruck , also for his darts out of dummyhalf. His passing game got better and he is a popular figure amongst the playing group . As you said a couple of wingers a hard arse edge runner , a fit and firing Siro anything is possible.

 

[Snake]

Yep. Api huge defensive loss. But I did wonder quite often if the attacking heroics of Marty and AFB i\were in any way matched by their defensive efforts? Seemed a bit soft/sloppy to me.

You are absolute right but the 9 keeps the props honest; defends in between the two, sets the line-speed, talks, etc.

 

[Chip and Chase]

We don't seem to be any good at slowing down rucks these days - teams just always seem to get a roll on against us with ease. I'm sure there was a stat floating around about average play the ball speed - I'd love to know what ours was in terms of what we conceeded on average and how that stacked up against the other 15 sides. I wouldn't mind betting we allowed the fastest average play the ball of all sides. It was like we couldn't slow down momentum without giving away a penalty. I suspect that has a lot to do with dominant tackles which earn you a bit more leeway in terms of laying on or working over the tackled player - on average our defence doesn't seem to dominate tackles, even though they might be effective in making the tackle it doesn't slow the roll on down sufficiently which leads to the back pedal / slide instead of the set and off the line positive D.

 

[XV-1]

The top 4 teams in the competition after 25 rounds are also the top 4 defensive sides. I believe that says EVERYTHING. Manly btw defensively are Last/Spoon.

Manly under Des and when they made the GF in 2013 were always in the top 2 defensive teams.

We need to buy a defensive back rower who can tackle his guts out like Api and Jake. Our attack will thrive if we can defensively keep teams out in 2019.

 

[1969]

I'm very pleased Api re-signed. He is a bit of a dog with a bone, and very strong for his size. Fainu is young and will learn a lot from Api as his backup.

 

[The Who]

Don't forget that our backline defence had more holes than Swiss cheese.
Api is good, but even he wouldn't be able to cover the weaknesses of our outside backs.

 

[anthonyb1965]

API = big defence loss.

What annoyed me is the “catch the player” defence. Move up and hit FFS! They all bend pretty easy when hit hard and the wrestle should be so simple after that.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

The fact that our backline leaks more than “ the leak “ leaks Manly news is important as well.

By the way after 3 beers I’m ready for a leak before dinner!!

 

[Nice Beaver]

A lot has been said about how poor we defended this year and of course you cannot argue that...but...I really think people might be underestimating the impact that losing Koroisau had on our season. I totally understand that we were already falling apart before he got injured but not to the extent that it fell apart when he went down.

I think Fainu is a fine prospect and did a better job than anyone could ask; this is in no way a criticism of his game. However, defending at 9 is the toughest job in RL and that is what separates the rookies from the seasoned first graders. It has nothing to do with creativity or service, that is another debate altogether. But the middle of the ruck has been loose for weeks because Api is probably in the top 3 defensive hookers in the game.

It has nothing to do with missed tackles or tackle counts either. It's everything to do with consistent line speed and chopping the player down, winning the ruck and getting up quickly at marker. These are not things that show up in statistics.

We couldn't cope with the opposition packs getting a roll on week in week out. We will be a much better side if he can play the bulk of 2019.

Whilst on the subject of next season, Manly need to buy two fast wingers.

You're the man who usually has the good oil, mate.

Any prospective signings who run 11 flat for the 100 metres?

 

[sheridanstand78]

We do not defend attacking kicks and our own attacking kicks are ineffective as a rule and yesterday cost us two trys against!!

Our defence has been ordinary since 2014. We have this very bad habit of indiscipline, which starts from a dropped ball, a penalty conceded and the inevitable try that becomes a back to back try and we lose a clump of points and we are often out of business in games, an all too familiar pattern since our last great team!!

 

[nightster]

Agree 110% on both points, AND a HARD forward to replace Penny Lane!!

 

[nightster]

You're the man who usually has the good oil, mate.

Any prospective signings who run 11 flat for the 100 metres?

Corey Oates - Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - Robert Jennings all off contract

 

[BOZO]

A lot has been said about how poor we defended this year and of course you cannot argue that...but...I really think people might be underestimating the impact that losing Koroisau had on our season. I totally understand that we were already falling apart before he got injured but not to the extent that it fell apart when he went down.

I think Fainu is a fine prospect and did a better job than anyone could ask; this is in no way a criticism of his game. However, defending at 9 is the toughest job in RL and that is what separates the rookies from the seasoned first graders. It has nothing to do with creativity or service, that is another debate altogether. But the middle of the ruck has been loose for weeks because Api is probably in the top 3 defensive hookers in the game.

It has nothing to do with missed tackles or tackle counts either. It's everything to do with consistent line speed and chopping the player down, winning the ruck and getting up quickly at marker. These are not things that show up in statistics.

We couldn't cope with the opposition packs getting a roll on week in week out. We will be a much better side if he can play the bulk of 2019.

Whilst on the subject of next season, Manly need to buy two fast wingers.

Api has has nothing to do with our defensive lapses out wide in the centres and on the wings
As you correctly pointed out we were falling apart up the middle before he got injured
If Trent does not go nothing changes

 

[Shnorky]

We don't seem to be any good at slowing down rucks these days - teams just always seem to get a roll on against us with ease. I'm sure there was a stat floating around about average play the ball speed - I'd love to know what ours was in terms of what we conceeded on average and how that stacked up against the other 15 sides. I wouldn't mind betting we allowed the fastest average play the ball of all sides. It was like we couldn't slow down momentum without giving away a penalty. I suspect that has a lot to do with dominant tackles which earn you a bit more leeway in terms of laying on or working over the tackled player - on average our defence doesn't seem to dominate tackles, even though they might be effective in making the tackle it doesn't slow the roll on down sufficiently which leads to the back pedal / slide instead of the set and off the line positive D.

It's called manly loading
We only get 2 seconds to leave a tackle whereas teams such as storm soak up 5 seconds most of the time. No wonder the game has so little free running

 

[Nice Beaver]

Malakai going back to Panthers I think...

And as great as Oates is, we don't have $750k to spend on a winger

 

[KNUCKLES]

Corey Oates - Malakai Watene-Zelezniak - Robert Jennings all off contract

Oates to Newcastle
Mwz to Penrith
Jennings??