Is Gorman teflon coated .. ?

[lurker]

That he confided in Gus is factual ..... your contention that he did this knowing it would be "leaked" is conjecture and just opinion as I stated .... without fact ..

So your argument is that he’s naive?

Talking to a media personality who makes money and profile having information other people don’t

 

[Woodsie]

So your argument is that he’s naive?

Talking to a media personality who makes money and profile having information other people don’t

No .... that is the point ..... I don't give motivation to others peoples actions ... then condem them claiming that my "reasons" for them doing something are correct ......

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

Mate, I know as fact that Trent imposed an alcohol ban, which was ignored. I think it was about 4 weeks before the end of the season.

It was after the flogging we got from The Eels I think (or Chooks) - can't remember, where all the players were out partying to all hours (my niece interacting with them dispite my protests).

Barrett also told the group not to go out at Gladstone (which was also ignored, and I heard Trent was actually with them in the end).

Not sure why these Indian Bong smoking gizmos are all the buzz with the team ATM (not illegal btw). Or why they'd smoke on social media (in my mind, just looks ridiculous, but I'm a fossil).

Honestly, our players aren't taking their careers seriously. They believe they rule the roost. They decide on who should coach, which player should sign, as there is 0 accountability.

That's why the LAST thing we need, is a laid back, have 27 beers with the boys Cartwright. We need a hard head that will tear up contracts if they do the wrong thing, aren't on the bus, and aren't dedicated to the cause.

It's all about partying, gaming, and the celebrity status right now. I'm sure they think they are in an American gang or something. Home Boys. LOL.

I can't agree strongly enough. These players are like the crazies running the asylum. We need a strong innovative coach who loves his payers, supports his players, coaches and mentors his players but also will be tough and bring the crazies into line and it doesn't matter if you are DCE or the youngest player - you toe the line or move aside. I really believe Barrett will be a very good coach BUT he fell into the trap of getting too close to the players. Sadly Maguire was the man for the job!

 

[lurker]

No .... that is the point ..... I don't give motivation to others peoples actions ... then condem them claiming that my "reasons" for them doing something are correct ......

Naive is not a motivation. Naive refers to a state of mind. I’m saying he was either stupid to talk to gus (naive is more polite) or he meant for stuff to happen. Neither is a good look and he lost my respect. Blind Freddy would know that if you talk to Gus 9 times out of 10 it’s making its way into the public domain.

In my view he tarnished the club. You haven’t showed me any proof anyone bagged him before he went to gus so I’ll stand by my view

 

[lurker]

No .... that is the point ..... I don't give motivation to others peoples actions ... then condem them claiming that my "reasons" for them doing something are correct ......

Also isn’t that exactly what you do about our owners consistently? Logic bomb!! Haha

 

[Woodsie]

Naive is not a motivation. Naive refers to a state of mind. I’m saying he was either stupid to talk to gus (naive is more polite) or he meant for stuff to happen. Neither is a good look and he lost my respect. Blind Freddy would know that if you talk to Gus 9 times out of 10 it’s making its way into the public domain.

In my view he tarnished the club. You haven’t showed me any proof anyone bagged him before he went to gus so I’ll stand by my view

Well .... let's look at an alternative scenario ...... Baz has known Gus for some 22 years, Gus has been a mentor to Baz throughout his playing and embryonic coaching career, Gus even recommended Baz to Bozo, and was instrumental in getting him the position ...

When Baz was at the point of pulling the pin for what we believe to be broken promises and lack of support ....... and upset to the point of considering handing in his notice, putting his entire career on the line ...... it does not surprise me at all that he would ring a long time friend and mentor, especially the one that recommended him for the job, to obtain some council .......

Telling Gus that we didn't have a recruitment Officer etc are hardly state secrets ..... and as far tarnishing the club, seriously .... I think Penn breaking promises and penny pinching would have him covered on that score ...

In your world that may be unusual or strange .... and you may wish to place all manner of evil or machaevelian plot twists and motivations .... but generally Occram's Razor is true in most cases ..... and the simple reasons the most likely ...

But getting back to my point .... whilst both of us are entitled to our opinion .... neither of us are entitled to our own facts .... to invent reasons for anothers actions based on your own prejudices and then crucify that person is .......

 

[Woodsie]

Also isn’t that exactly what you do about our owners consistently? Logic bomb!! Haha

You will note I use words like "I don't know" and "percieved" or "appears" and I tend to raise the issue as a debate ...... as you will note if you re-read the post that started this thread ......

I am asking the question .... have we given Gorman some slack?

PSS .. I rarely if ever state my opinion as a conclusive fact ..... but if I do .... I am always right.

 

[manly al]

Significant point continues to be that Baz "s quite public and expressive indignation and blame game grievances and diversions seemed to conveniently correspond with quite a bit of heat being directed at some of his coaching methods and tactics and some very indifferent form from the Manly teams mid year or so . May have missed something but not once did i notice any really constructive or relevant reasons or explanations by Baz to address or try to rectify an in general under performing Manly effort and some of his very questionable game plans and tactics in many matches at that stage of the season . Instead just a continuation of the repetitious and largely diversion excuses that this is still a young side and injuries [ which admittedly did have some partial relevance ] but never actual footy performance related reasons . Can:t help but still have a strong suspicion that Baz was then looking for any means then to divert attention away from his own short comings and poor game results outcomes and apart from having difficulties contending with the heat and valid criticism , just tried to create a fail safe position for him , to receive a payout whatever the fall out may have then transpired . Whether this would have been Manly sacking him or dragging matters out, again with the main motivation for a pay out of some description regardless .. Without any real justification or ethics , Baz "s interests totally the first priority , the Manly club in general and his players and club supporters a very distant next . Not conspiracy reasoning , just some real life and event based occurrences and very reasonable conclusions .

 

[lurker]

Well .... let's look at an alternative scenario ...... Baz has known Gus for some 22 years, Gus has been a mentor to Baz throughout his playing and embryonic coaching career, Gus even recommended Baz to Bozo, and was instrumental in getting him the position ...

When Baz was at the point of pulling the pin for what we believe to be broken promises and lack of support ....... and upset to the point of considering handing in his notice, putting his entire career on the line ...... it does not surprise me at all that he would ring a long time friend and mentor, especially the one that recommended him for the job, to obtain some council .......

Telling Gus that we didn't have a recruitment Officer etc are hardly state secrets ..... and as far tarnishing the club, seriously .... I think Penn breaking promises and penny pinching would have him covered on that score ...

In your world that may be unusual or strange .... and you may wish to place all manner of evil or machaevelian plot twists and motivations .... but generally Occram's Razor is true in most cases ..... and the simple reasons the most likely ...

But getting back to my point .... whilst both of us are entitled to our opinion .... neither of us are entitled to our own facts .... to invent reasons for anothers actions based on your own prejudices and then crucify that person is .......

Read my post before you try to come up with some eloquent response to try to put me down and make me appear less than. The whole time I said “in my view” or “I’m saying” they are both opinions not facts.

You constantly refer to owners being tight arses on penny pinchers. Isn’t that inventing reasons for actions which is exactly what you’re accusing me of doing? Even you saying breaking promises is inventing facts because what evidence is there he made promises beyond what you or the media are stating. You can’t have it both ways. To quote you “to invent reasons for another’s actions based on your own prejudices and then crucify that person is .....”.

I believe the term for that is hypocrisy

Another saying might be those in glass houses........

I’ll always be loyal to the club not to a st George bloke that IN MY VIEW doesn’t give a rats about the fans, the club or anything other than his payout.

Wasn’t @Supreme Leader’s mail months ago that he was moving back to the gong. Way before half this broke?

 

[Woodsie]

I’ll always be loyal to the club not to a st George bloke that IN MY VIEW doesn’t give a rats about the fans, the club or anything other than his payout.

You were going ok and sounding rational until this ......

And if you interprted my responses to you as a put down, they weren't ..... and if it makes you feel better .... in future when I give an opinion on the Penn's lack of resoursing of the club I will use the words "alleged" penny pinching .....

and it may just be that the selfless actions of that St. George bloke standing up to the "alledged" penny pinching of Penn will be the catalyst of change that begins our return to the Manly of old ....... we may very well owe Baz our eternal thanks ...

 

[lurker]

You were going ok and sounding rational until this ......

And if you interprted my responses to you as a put down, they weren't ..... and if it makes you feel better .... in future when I give an opinion on the Penn's lack of resoursing of the club I will use the words "alleged" penny pinching .....

and it may just be that the selfless actions of that St. George bloke standing up to the "alledged" penny pinching of Penn will be the catalyst of change that begins our return to the Manly of old ....... we may very well owe Baz our eternal thanks ...

I think we have a different definition of selfless. In my book selfless isn’t having a notice period put in your contract and then trying to get paid out (somewhere between 300-500k, no one knows what it actually is).

I just think a lot of it came across as diversionary when he was devoid of ideas. If we stick just with playing performance nothing seemed to change. We just kept trying to play the same way. Then having to watch those dejected press conferences. If he’s a leader he needs to be strong. If he’s always the first one to drop his head what sort of msg does it send to the players.

As an attacking side I thought we were great to his credit. We could put points on anyone. But our middle defense was pathetic. We were brittle. That’s an attitude thing. And when the players stopped playing for him he didn’t have an explanation

He didn’t seem to be able to change things up. For me all of this drama has been a distraction from the fact that we had a great side on paper that played rubbish as a team. And I think a lot of that is down to coaching. Not whether we did or didn’t have a recruitment manager or whether we’re in demountables. It’s all become distracting noise

 

[Woodsie]

I think we have a different definition of selfless. In my book selfless isn’t having a notice period put in your contract and then trying to get paid out (somewhere between 300-500k, no one knows what it actually is).

I just think a lot of it came across as diversionary when he was devoid of ideas. If we stick just with playing performance nothing seemed to change. We just kept trying to play the same way. Then having to watch those dejected press conferences. If he’s a leader he needs to be strong. If he’s always the first one to drop his head what sort of msg does it send to the players.

As an attacking side I thought we were great to his credit. We could put points on anyone. But our middle defense was pathetic. We were brittle. That’s an attitude thing. And when the players stopped playing for him he didn’t have an explanation

He didn’t seem to be able to change things up. For me all of this drama has been a distraction from the fact that we had a great side on paper that played rubbish as a team. And I think a lot of that is down to coaching. Not whether we did or didn’t have a recruitment manager or whether we’re in demountables. It’s all become distracting noise

lurker said: ↑
I think we have a different definition of selfless. In my book selfless isn’t having a notice period put in your contract and then trying to get paid out (somewhere between 300-500k, no one knows what it actually is).

How do you know it was not Penn that wanted the 12 month notice clause .... or heaven forbid ... mutual

I just think a lot of it came across as diversionary when he was devoid of ideas. If we stick just with playing performance nothing seemed to change. We just kept trying to play the same way. Then having to watch those dejected press conferences. If he’s a leader he needs to be strong. If he’s always the first one to drop his head what sort of msg does it send to the players.

Your opinion ..... I think he came across as honest and genuine ...

As an attacking side I thought we were great to his credit. We could put points on anyone. But our middle defense was pathetic. We were brittle. That’s an attitude thing. And when the players stopped playing for him he didn’t have an explanation

Your opinion .... I think he held the side together during a fukked up season ...

He didn’t seem to be able to change things up. For me all of this drama has been a distraction from the fact that we had a great side on paper that played rubbish as a team. And I think a lot of that is down to coaching. Not whether we did or didn’t have a recruitment manager or whether we’re in demountables. It’s all become distracting noise

Hard to change things up when you only have 20 fit players ..... and those the youngest side in the comp by an average of 2 years .... a backline with 3 x 2o year olds in it .... some might even say we missed APi and Walker at crucial times ... silly buggers .

But, coaching aside .... if the drama changes the owners attitude .... and we see (as we are suddenly hearing) noises about Toovey, Ballin and the Eagles Angels being re-ingaged, then I vote we build a statue to Baz in the Corso

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

I love a bun fight , and ST never dissapoints does it!

 

[lurker]

lurker said: ↑
I think we have a different definition of selfless. In my book selfless isn’t having a notice period put in your contract and then trying to get paid out (somewhere between 300-500k, no one knows what it actually is).

How do you know it was not Penn that wanted the 12 month notice clause .... or heaven forbid ... mutual

I just think a lot of it came across as diversionary when he was devoid of ideas. If we stick just with playing performance nothing seemed to change. We just kept trying to play the same way. Then having to watch those dejected press conferences. If he’s a leader he needs to be strong. If he’s always the first one to drop his head what sort of msg does it send to the players.

Your opinion ..... I think he came across as honest and genuine ...

As an attacking side I thought we were great to his credit. We could put points on anyone. But our middle defense was pathetic. We were brittle. That’s an attitude thing. And when the players stopped playing for him he didn’t have an explanation

Your opinion .... I think he held the side together during a fukked up season ...

He didn’t seem to be able to change things up. For me all of this drama has been a distraction from the fact that we had a great side on paper that played rubbish as a team. And I think a lot of that is down to coaching. Not whether we did or didn’t have a recruitment manager or whether we’re in demountables. It’s all become distracting noise

Hard to change things up when you only have 20 fit players ..... and those the youngest side in the comp by an average of 2 years .... a backline with 3 x 2o year olds in it .... some might even say we missed APi and Walker at crucial times ... silly buggers .

But, coaching aside .... if the drama changes the owners attitude .... and we see (as we are suddenly hearing) noises about Toovey, Ballin and the Eagles Angels being re-ingaged, then I vote we build a statue to Baz in the Corso

Does writing in big letters make your argument more convincing?

 

[lurker]

lurker said: ↑
I think we have a different definition of selfless. In my book selfless isn’t having a notice period put in your contract and then trying to get paid out (somewhere between 300-500k, no one knows what it actually is).

How do you know it was not Penn that wanted the 12 month notice clause .... or heaven forbid ... mutual

I just think a lot of it came across as diversionary when he was devoid of ideas. If we stick just with playing performance nothing seemed to change. We just kept trying to play the same way. Then having to watch those dejected press conferences. If he’s a leader he needs to be strong. If he’s always the first one to drop his head what sort of msg does it send to the players.

Your opinion ..... I think he came across as honest and genuine ...

As an attacking side I thought we were great to his credit. We could put points on anyone. But our middle defense was pathetic. We were brittle. That’s an attitude thing. And when the players stopped playing for him he didn’t have an explanation

Your opinion .... I think he held the side together during a fukked up season ...

He didn’t seem to be able to change things up. For me all of this drama has been a distraction from the fact that we had a great side on paper that played rubbish as a team. And I think a lot of that is down to coaching. Not whether we did or didn’t have a recruitment manager or whether we’re in demountables. It’s all become distracting noise

Hard to change things up when you only have 20 fit players ..... and those the youngest side in the comp by an average of 2 years .... a backline with 3 x 2o year olds in it .... some might even say we missed APi and Walker at crucial times ... silly buggers .

But, coaching aside .... if the drama changes the owners attitude .... and we see (as we are suddenly hearing) noises about Toovey, Ballin and the Eagles Angels being re-ingaged, then I vote we build a statue to Baz in the Corso

Woodsie this is my last response to you. You just said in your big letters my opinion multiple times. No **** Sherlock. I started the paragraph with “i think” the other one I started with “I thought”. Those are the definition of opinions so give it a break and stop trying to pull me up. I’m not passing them off as facts. They are reasoned opinions

 

[Woodsie]

Does writing in big letters make your argument more convincing?

No .... as my comments were interspersed between yours ... it differentiated them ...it worked ... you could tell the difference ...

 

[Woodsie]

Woodsie this is my last response to you. You just said in your big letters my opinion multiple times. No **** Sherlock. I started the paragraph with “i think” the other one I started with “I thought”. Those are the definition of opinions so give it a break and stop trying to pull me up. I’m not passing them off as facts. They are reasoned opinions

Thank the lord ... but we could start a new arguement on the meaning of the word "reasoned" ....

 

[Kevinward777]

So your argument is that he’s naive?

Talking to a media personality who makes money and profile having information other people don’t

So what your saying is he’s either vindictive or a complete fool as well as being the worst performed Manly coach in the modern era? I can live with that... there’s no doubt the players love the bloke and that our organisation is currently being run like it’s amateur hour. But facts are facts... Barrett has failed as a head coach and needs to go... the owners need to pull their fingers out and start resourcing the place better. But if anyone thinks a good coach would have had us running fifteenth with the squad we have... yeah nah... Barrett fixed NOTHING all season... why are we even talking about him?

 

[Kevinward777]

Woodsie this is my last response to you. You just said in your big letters my opinion multiple times. No **** Sherlock. I started the paragraph with “i think” the other one I started with “I thought”. Those are the definition of opinions so give it a break and stop trying to pull me up. I’m not passing them off as facts. They are reasoned opinions

After three seasons his win percentage is worse than Peter Sharps was... that’s a fact.

 

[Woodsie]

Twice in the telecrap today Gorman is qouted as saying that a "full" review of the football dept will be completed before the players return on the 5th Nov.

1) Is this true ....?
2) If so ... who is conducting it?
3) Why was this significant and full review not important enough to mention previously, like at a members council or Members night?
4) Or are you just making shiite up on the run ???

maybe it is a reaction to Parra's review announcement yesterday ..