The Daly Cherrygraph

[47MVEagle]

I get paid far, far less than DCE yet if I carried on as unprofessionally as he has this season, no doubt I'd be shown the door.

There will always be someone you don't get along with in the workplace - it's how you handle them that counts. Going on live TV acting like a jilted lover isn't the way.

 

[Bearfax]

Leonard already did, right here, but you haven't addressed that.


DCE leaving, DCE wanting more money, DCE not wanting to be disrespected, DCE wanting to be at a stronger club .... whatever, true or untrue, fair enough.
But not sure how you defend his channel 9 bombshell (which he doubled down on soon after, by referring to a smear campaign)

DCE leaving. So what. Players leave and some leave for bigger money. Foran, everyone champion left Manly for bigger money. He wasn't maligned. DCE wanting more money? Why then join SC for less than offer by Manly. DCE not wanting to be disrespected. Where does that come from. He recently tried to repair damage that was brought about not by something to do with the fans but something to do with the Club it seems. DCE wanting to be with a stronger club. In his last year? Fulton and Vautin also former Manly captains went to SC for bigger money. DCE it seems didn't. And describe the bombshell for us again. Was it as I suggest an implied disagreement with the Manly club we have not be told about? No evidence here.

 

[Bearfax]

I get paid far, far less than DCE yet if I carried on as unprofessionally as he has this season, no doubt I'd be shown the door.

There will always be someone you don't get along with in the workplace - it's how you handle them that counts. Going on live TV acting like a jilted lover isn't the way.

Conjecture. This guy is 36, the oldest playing the game. He's not going to play like a 25 year old. Might surprise you but bodies do wear our. I remember playing into my early 30s and I was nowhere near the player I was five years before. Not that I was ever any better than a hack player in Union, and certainly not at the top tier, but I still tried hard. If you think you can expect someone that age to be still playing outstanding at 36, you're dreaming. Maybe the pressure he was facing following the criticisme he's been receiving all year was taking its toll. Who knows. But I don't think he was intentionally reducing his effort.

 

[47MVEagle]

DCE leaving. So what. Players leave and some leave for bigger money. Foran, everyone champion left Manly for bigger money. He wasn't maligned. DCE wanting more money? Why then join SC for less than offer by Manly. DCE not wanting to be disrespected. Where does that come from. He recently tried to repair damage that was brought about not by something to do with the fans but something to do with the Club it seems. DCE wanting to be with a stronger club. In his last year? Fulton and Vautin also former Manly captains went to SC for bigger money. DCE it seems didn't. And describe the bombshell for us again. Was it as I suggest an implied disagreement with the Manly club we have not be told about? No evidence here.

Foran wasn't maligned? Are you forgetting he signed with Parra but didn't tell the club until DCE had agreed to a contract at the Titans, causing the club to throw overs at DCE & the backflip? What about criticism of his blatant lack of effort in some games in the 2015 season?

I think Foran has been forgiven due to what he went through after leaving Manly the first time & also because he came back & redeemed himself, but to say he wasn't maligned is a stretch.

 

[47MVEagle]

Conjecture. This guy is 36, the oldest playing the game. He's not going to play like a 25 year old. Might surprise you but bodies do wear our. I remember playing into my early 30s and I was nowhere near the player I was five years before. Not that I was ever any better than a hack player in Union, and certainly not at the top tier, but I still tried hard. If you think you can expect someone that age to be still playing outstanding at 36, you're dreaming. Maybe the pressure he was facing following the criticisme he's been receiving all year was taking its toll. Who knows. But I don't think he was intentionally reducing his effort.

I was referring to him going on TV in non-club gear & explicitly saying he would not be at Manly next season without the club's knowledge, & claiming there was a smear campaign against him at the following week's post-match presser.

 

[Cochrane]

Vautin was on the nose with manly and given a ridiculously low offer. He didn't go looking for another team to play for and basically forced out. Read his book.

I wish people would stop using Vautin as an example.

I have no issues with dce leaving for better money or opportunity.

Fulton showed some class and told arko what he got offered which was a ridiculous amount from Packer. Arko said we will never match that and gave him his blessing to go.

I didn't see Fulton, vautin or any previous or current captain for any club go on TV to announce he wants to play elsewhere and does not want to play for his current club, as a current captain. What a kick in the teeth for any club. He 'apparently' didn't even know where he was going to go to, just wanted to go tv and say that.

That is my only issue.

I know you are responding to other areas that people raise Bearfax, but the above is the crux of the issue.

 

[Bearfax]

Yes I’ll grant you that.

But I think as fans of the club he plays for , and has played for now for 15 years , we are probably entitled to an opinion.

And both the pro & anti brigades have strong opinions , and very much tend to manipulate what they think has happened to suit their narrative.

I just think all that’s been said , has now been said , he’s got 1 game to go , and then he’s no longer a Sea Eagle.

I’ll still hold my strong view , but just as I did for his 350th game, I’ll wish him well for his last home game.

If I was there ( I won’t be ) I wouldn’t be booing or waving silly signs , rather I’d politely clap as he entered & left the field.

I just think it’s time for everyone to move on , anything raised has been raised a 1000 times before , we are achieving nothing by discussing it any further.

We know he’s going to the Rorters.
We know he hates Manly

But he’ll be like many , a valued “ old boy “ when the dust settles.

Just be good to see this thread die a natural death ( it won’t of course ), as there’s really nothing more to add to the whole sorry story.

I take some of your points but some I strongly disagree with. I don't think he hates Manly at all. I suspect he hates something we are not being told about behind the scenes between him and management. The pieces fit that scenario. The point is DCE has been our best players for the past decade, except when Turbo is at his best. This is supported by critics of the game such as the Dally M. who identify him near the very top in performance . year by year. I've always considered he tried his hardest to get the team over the line. But he couldn't do it alone. However for some reason many on this site blame him for Manly's failure to succeed. Paid too much money, makes wrong choices on the field, should have kicked better. The criticisms go on and on. However outside of the coaching dilemma, virtually no other player except maybe Schuster, copped any ongoing serious flack. Its all DCEs fault somehow. That disappoints me because I think DCE has been our best half since I started watching since 1965. Personal opinion, but other than Toovey I can think of none other coming close. I personally treasure his efforts for the Sea Eagles.

 

[Bearfax]

I was referring to him going on TV in non-club gear & explicitly saying he would not be at Manly next season without the club's knowledge, & claiming there was a smear campaign against him at the following week's post-match presser.

And what do you infer from that. Consider the motivation. Follow the implication. Obvious to me. He was upset with something behind the scenes that crossed the line for him. Obvious. He's making a statement. Not wearing a Manly outfit fits that statement. I doubt that the question of a smear campaign was relevant to that decision so saying that misses the point. Think it through. If you were a high profile player and those in charge did something that was truly hurtful, or perhaps insulting, maybe over an extended period, would you sit back and do nothing. The fact that he said nothing shows a great deal of restrain I would suggest. I'm sure he wanted to say, but that's not his style as has been shown before especially after the Titans issue. You're looking at the outcome, not the cause. Something happened that he was not prepared to tolerate even to the point of refusing a higher wage packet compared to what SC finally offered.

 

[47MVEagle]

And what do you infer from that. Consider the motivation. Follow the implication. Obvious to me. He was upset with something behind the scenes that crossed the line for him. Obvious. He's making a statement. Not wearing a Manly outfit fits that statement. I doubt that the question of a smear campaign was relevant to that decision so saying that misses the point. Think it through. If you were a high profile player and those in charge did something that was truly hurtful, or perhaps insulting, maybe over an extended period, would you sit back and do nothing. The fact that he said nothing shows a great deal of restrain I would suggest. I'm sure he wanted to say, but that's not his style as has been shown before especially after the Titans issue. You're looking at the outcome, not the cause. Something happened that he was not prepared to tolerate even to the point of refusing a higher wage packet compared to what SC finally offered.

It was totally unprofessional & unbefitting of a club captain.

He's the President of the RLPA - why not go down that path instead of publicly announcing it?

 

[jbb/james]

That's the point Mark. He's being demonised by conjecture. No one really know, though based on what's happened we can surmise regarding what is most probable based on what we do know. Just as well none of those defaming him had to present evidence in court. They'd be torn apart and perhaps charged with defamation of character. Easy to say these things at a distance. No repercussions

Some could say he was idolised on conjecture for years and it caught up with him.
His ability to be centre of camera when someone else scores is legendary

Of course we are here to talk about the what ifs, or the who knows, and no one does as @Mark from Brisbane points out but that works both ways .

At the end of the day he has built a fortress of speculation by his own actions and I am sure he will drink the media coffee when at seasons end . Its his Industry and its well known for it . I also doubt he is finished with us or someone at manly

People change clubs every week , people fall out with clubs all the time, but there is only 1 cherry, but like most of cherries bombs it missed the mark by a country mile

I love your dedication to your man @Bearfax , your loyalty , and of course you do speak a lot of sense , but what is it that makes you defender of his cause ?

This is Australia, everyone is judged on bulldung. Its our culture and its sad ,but if your in the spotlight you should be aware.

Ultimately he has a million dollar contract. His honour is how he plays that contract out despite not liking someone. We have sponsors to appease , fans, memberships. Again its not just about him
Fark me how does he retain honour after round 3 .
It looked like he wanted to break up with us before we broke up with him.
Thats butthurt , not honour

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

I take some of your points but some I strongly disagree with. I don't think he hates Manly at all. I suspect he hates something we are not being told about behind the scenes between him and management. The pieces fit that scenario. The point is DCE has been our best players for the past decade, except when Turbo is at his best. This is supported by critics of the game such as the Dally M. who identify him near the very top in performance . year by year. I've always considered he tried his hardest to get the team over the line. But he couldn't do it alone. However for some reason many on this site blame him for Manly's failure to succeed. Paid too much money, makes wrong choices on the field, should have kicked better. The criticisms go on and on. However outside of the coaching dilemma, virtually no other player except maybe Schuster, copped any ongoing serious flack. It’s all DCEs fault somehow. That disappoints me because I think DCE has been our best half since I started watching since 1965. Personal opinion, but other than Toovey I can think of none other coming close. I personally treasure his efforts for the Sea Eagles.

Ditto , I get your point of view , but strongly disagree with it ( just as you do with mine).

But unlike many on here , I understand that your opinions are just that opinions , neither of us are 100% right nor are we 100% wrong ( until categorically proved otherwise ) however we are both entitled to give those opinions on this forum and be respected for them regardless of if you agree or disagree.

 

[LeonardCohen]

Where's your evidence Leonard. . His actions are consistent with his behavioural characteristics. His motivation strongly suggest what I'm saying. I'm not saying I'm right, it’s just in my opinion it’s the highest probability compared to other options. I look at the arguments against and they are unsupported by factual evidence. My sense is that there is a strong tendency to dislike the guy which distorts perspective. The sense that he is arrogant, strongly confident. But wait, it could also be that he's quite reserved, an often mistaken quality. Does he big note himself verbally. . Outside of his minor stoush with Hastings and his strong advice to Schuster regarding commitment, you tell what he has done wrong. We like the flawed characters, the underdogs. Tall poppies we tend to suspect of hidden flaws. Thing is tell me in factual terms what he has done wrong. Not conjecture. Fact.

I could just as easily ask you where your evidence is…neither of us have any and if I’m really honest, I’d love to know what I meant support with evidence…I thought it was clear from the low modality of my language that I wasn’t suggesting facts.

I’m not even bothered with the reason for his leaving anyway…I was only challenging your argument that he displayed honour…so I have to ask you this…

when he went on 100% Footy, he made it clear there was an issue with Manly and/or someone at Manly (if you don’t believe that subtext, don’t read on and don’t worry about replying). So, given that issue exists, is the honourable approach to dealing with it, a feature story with Danny Weidler, out of club colours, after rd.3? Or can you think of a more honourable alternative?

I ask that you please answer that question and avoid circular logic. I should also point out that I’m not one of his haters and if anything, I’m very upset he’s leaving…does that mean he’s perfect and always makes the right choices in how he presents himself to the media? Probably not.