Coach Seibold thoughts so far.... so good

[Phobia]

The biggest myth going around on here is that we need a "Manly man"

We won comps with Bozo and Des because they were all time great coaches - not because they played for the club.

We just need a really good coach no matter the background

We also had some great operators steering the ship, unlike an owner who had players changing out the back of their cars less than ten years ago...

I'm of the opinion that correct opinions can come from the wrong people. Barrett complained that the football department didn't have enough funding or staff from Penn. So Penn hired a notably solo coach, who only wanted a skeleton crew staff, to keep those expenses down.

As a result we are light-years behind the rest of the competition, who realised in ~2016 that they needed to adapt or die. There's a reason only three clubs have won premierships since then.

 

[eaglebuzz]

How much time is enough time?

In Des' first stint, the team finished in 13th, 8th, 5th, 2nd (Runners-up)... then won two premierships in the next 4 years.

Since then, we had Toovey and Des v2... both missed the finals in their 4th year as coach and were shown the door. Was that enough time or not?

Seibold as Manly coach has finished 12th, 7th, and in his third year we can very feasibly make the finals... and quite a few here seem to want him sacked yesterday.

One thing I have appreciated about Siebold is that the squad has gotten stronger every year since he arrived. He has tried to cut dead wood and add value where he can. Looks like next year could be our best yet in that regard.

 

[Pete W]

To channel a bit of @LeonardCohen, as always, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Seibold's circumstances make it difficult for any one coach to thrive in such an amateur-run organisation.

But, at the same time, this means that it is even more paramount that the head coach of this proud, yet complicated club be of a certain character - strong, passionate, obsessive, and unyielding.

Unfortunately, Seibold couldn't make it work at an enormously-funded giant in the Brisbane Broncos, with all the resources at his disposal, nor can he succeed at Manly. He's simply not 'tough' enough under pressure, and his players inevitably pick up on his weakness as a leader. Campfire chats, coffee dates, 7 min reflection sessions, buzzwords, constant media justification... Too much energy spent on the little things, not enough of the stuff that really matters in the brutal men's game of rugby league.

He is very precise and orgsnised with training, travel, and recovery management. Clearly great with workplace etiquette etc. He would do well in the corporate side of things, and I suspect he and his closest confidantes have already come to this conclusion. Being an NRL head coach would be extremely taxing on a personal level, definitely not for everyone.

 

[Wombat64]

That view is as much conjecture as the complete opposite.

The people who would know the real story

The Dollar Chaser
His wife
Probably his parents
His manager
Our CEO
Our Coach

And until one of them wants to spill the beans we will never know , could be the coach , could be the hard nut CEO, could be Penn, could be not enough offered to his liking , or none offered.

Unless you have direct access to any of the above and they’ve given you approval to spill the beans it’s simply conjecture.

I’ll still stick with my view that regardless of the coach this year we’d still be having a poor year.

Yep, that forward pack with ancient plodders was never top 4 and the situation only got worse when Paseka went down.

Even if one of them spilt the beans on what happened it will be only one sides word against the others

The way he has done this.... the guy is a wanker.

 

[Jethro]

If we had the best coach, the decisions would have been different, and we wouldn't be in this position. I had the same gut feeling about Barrett that I have about Seibold, and even serious attempts to look for the positives has come up empty handed. I get what you are saying, and I respect your opinion, but we will be an "also ran" until we get a blue-blooded Manly Man in there who is given time ala Des in 2004. Back then, he had no better coaching credentials than, say Matt Ballin, but because he understood the culture he grew into the role.

That culture hasn't existed since 2014 and we can blame none other than Bozo (the real one) who was recruited by Penn, and he then sacked or forced out over half of the squad, sacked Toovey as coach and brought in an inexperienced and useless coach in Trent Barrett and his other useless supposedly experienced assistant coach in John Cartright. We have all seen how great that has worked out. At least Seibold has tried to get the culture back even though it seems to have had little effect.

 

[LeonardCohen]

To channel a bit of @LeonardCohen, as always, the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Seibold's circumstances make it difficult for any one coach to thrive in such an amateur-run organisation.

But, at the same time, this means that it is even more paramount that the head coach of this proud, yet complicated club be of a certain character - strong, passionate, obsessive, and unyielding.

Unfortunately, Seibold couldn't make it work at an enormously-funded giant in the Brisbane Broncos, with all the resources at his disposal, nor can he succeed at Manly. He's simply not 'tough' enough under pressure, and his players inevitably pick up on his weakness as a leader. Campfire chats, coffee dates, 7 min reflection sessions, buzzwords, constant media justification... Too much energy spent on the little things, not enough of the stuff that really matters in the brutal men's game of rugby league.

He is very precise and orgsnised with training, travel, and recovery management. Clearly great with workplace etiquette etc. He would do well in the corporate side of things, and I suspect he and his closest confidantes have already come to this conclusion. Being an NRL head coach would be extremely taxing on a personal level, definitely not for everyone.

Yes, I agree. I think Seibs is a perfect assistant coach. He can share his knowledge without being the guy tasked with motivating the squad. Further, his innovations can be tempered by a head coach that keeps things simple.

Seibold comes off as anything but inspiring and it’s rubbing off on the club. We have no identity. The team has no ‘brand’. We are just this hodgepodge of recruits around DCE and the Trbos, that collect a pay-check and show no real passion or desire for the cause.

Unfortunately, I don’t believe sacking Seibold will bring overnight relief for Manly. It’ll be a treacherous road back to success. I have no idea whether it’s worth walking that road for the long term health of the club or if we are better sticking it out for a little longer to see what can be done with the youth that are a couple of years off being ready.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

From my experience with Ha$ler ( albeit limited ) was he was tough , demanding , unyielding and that worked very well circa 2005-2011, as the players “ bought in “. But my point is the players of 20 years later simply don’t.

Case in point

Then he defected to the Bulldogs, and it “ sort of” worked for a little while but then his approach started to split the dressing room and totally piss off the board and as we know ended in heartache.

Then we have Manly 2.0 ( rinse & repeat of the Bulldogs).

Then he heads north to the Titans who are currently running dead last , and there are all sorts of rumours spreading up here that he’ll be sacked by years end.

People talk about our coach being “ too soft “ ( maybe he is , I’m not in the system to confirm or deny ) but I do wonder if modern day players ( or most ) don’t do your typical Des dictatorships very well.

Don’t confuse passion with being hard or soft , no doubt Bellamy is extremely passionate ( and apparently his players love him ) but that doesn’t mean behind the scenes he’s not an excellent , caring , man manager as opposed to “ these are my ****ing rules , stick to them or you can **** right off”.

Where Seibold sits in all this 🤷🤷🤷🤷🤷🤷

 

[Eagle 1]

Next 4 games after Rabbits might test this theory!

Kinda like the run of death....when does Ola come back, just asking..

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

Interesting points by @LeonardCohen and @Mark from Brisbane !

Ciraldo has clearly got his squad all buying in to whatever he's sold them. My guess is it is mostly about his blueprint for a winning style of play, which is based around fitness and aggression. Which seems a good fit for rugby league!

I've heard some suggest that to succeed an NRL coach must be a fitness fanatic. A hard arse. Someone who can intimidate the players. Basically scare them if they play badly. Inspire them with his inflamed passion for the club.

Seibold's 'modern' coaching philosophy doesn't appear to be about any of that. Maybe more like letting the players find the will and drive within themselves and their teammates. Along with offering technical analysis, tactics etc, based on how he sees the strengths of this group of players. Which clearly he can influence over time with recruitment decisions.

Not the traditional style of rugby league coach.

I like the idea of treating the players as adults rather than kids. Puts the responsibility on them. Can this style work in modern NRL? Dunno! But when I think of the Dogs I always have this unpleasant image of Crichton shoving his nose down the throat of Kyle Flanagan. Crichton is a great player but I don't want Manly to play like that. I want Manly to beat those aggro bastards by letting Koula and co fly down field with breathtaking athleticism (as we've done before).

 

[eaglebuzz]

I think Ballin would tick most if not all of the boxes, and Siebold transferring to ahead of operations role would actually make better use of his strengths. Ennis is the big wildcard in all that, though.

 

[Brookie1973]

Utoikamanu reveals Bellamy all-time spray that 'needed to happen' | Sporting News Australia

The Storm front-rower re-lived a famous dressing down from the legendary coach.

www.sportingnews.com

 

[Ralphie]

So let me understand this

A Manly coach would have stopped the D$E implosion ??

And would have instantly fixed our cap issues ??

And we wouldn’t have the injury crises with a Manly man ??

And you could add to that , would a Manly man see the owners pay more than lip service to the organisation ??

Look I get you hate Seibold , all good , we all have opinions , but I’m sorry I just don’t see how ( let’s say Ballin ) would magically have fixed all these issues and seen us in a better position.

So much on here is all about “ we only succeed with a Manly man “.

That’s certainly been the case in the past but NRL, circa 2025 is a completely different beast.

You said Best Coach and I also said best coach. Do you doubt that one of the top coaches would have handled everything better?. If you think that, then you are seriously delusional.

My only reference to Ballin was as an example and for the future rebuild. I did not reference him for the past issues.

 

[Mark from Brisbane]

You said Best Coach and I also said best coach. Do you doubt that one of the top coaches would have handled everything better?. If you think that, then you are seriously delusional.

My only reference to Ballin was as an example and for the future rebuild. I did not reference him for the past issues.

I doubt I’m delusional , just a differing opinion.

 

[Ralphie]

How much time is enough time?

In Des' first stint, the team finished in 13th, 8th, 5th, 2nd (Runners-up)... then won two premierships in the next 4 years.

Since then, we had Toovey and Des v2... both missed the finals in their 4th year as coach and were shown the door. Was that enough time or not?

Seibold as Manly coach has finished 12th, 7th, and in his third year we can very feasibly make the finals... and quite a few here seem to want him sacked yesterday.

5 Years with steady improvement and team harmony. We have not had that from Seibold.

 

[LeonardCohen]

Interesting points by @LeonardCohen and @Mark from Brisbane !

Ciraldo has clearly got his squad all buying in to whatever he's sold them. My guess is it is mostly about his blueprint for a winning style of play, which is based around fitness and aggression. Which seems a good fit for rugby league!

I've heard some suggest that to succeed an NRL coach must be a fitness fanatic. A hard arse. Someone who can intimidate the players. Basically scare them if they play badly. Inspire them with his inflamed passion for the club.

Seibold's 'modern' coaching philosophy doesn't appear to be about any of that. Maybe more like letting the players find the will and drive within themselves and their teammates. Along with offering technical analysis, tactics etc, based on how he sees the strengths of this group of players. Which clearly he can influence over time with recruitment decisions.

Not the traditional style of rugby league coach.

I like the idea of treating the players as adults rather than kids. Puts the responsibility on them. Can this style work in modern NRL? Dunno! But when I think of the Dogs I always have this unpleasant image of Crichton shoving his nose down the throat of Kyle Flanagan. Crichton is a great player but I don't want Manly to play like that. I want Manly to beat those aggro bastards by letting Koula and co fly down field with breathtaking athleticism (as we've done before).

I reckon there’s some truth to Seibold being petrified to lose the dressing room. He lost it in Brisbane (I recall Alex Glenn saying the senior players decided to start doing their own thing) and it cost him his job.

He was very arrogant at times in the media and the clipboard fiasco tells me he went in believing his own hype and was quickly humbled.

I also recall the Dogs purging their squad and Jackson Tapine’s well publicised criticism of Ciraldo’s methods. I have a sneaky suspicion that you don’t mess around inside the four walls of Canterbury and the players know it. The same goes for Melbourne.

So yeah, I reckon the hard arse approach works if you are the kind of personality that can sell it authentically; the way humans respond to each other is so complex that two people (coaches) can adopt the same approach and it will work for one and not necessarily for the other. The subliminal messages that a coach sends to the playing group are variables beyond the control of even the most self aware person; you either got it or you don’t.

I also think assuming a coach’s success rest entirely on their ‘style’ is short sighted. I don’t think there’s enough evidence to suggest that Des failed because the players changed and no longer warmed to his hard edge. By all accounts, he was very popular with his players and still is. However, the way the game is played has changed since he was successful and I wonder if that has more to do with his shortcomings than a personality mismatch with today’s footballer.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

The subliminal messages that a coach sends to the playing group are variables beyond the control of even the most self aware person; you either got it or you don’t.

Rings true. I recall thinking in one or 2 of the early Manly Way films it seemed a bit 'forced' a couple of times when Seibs swore when addressing the squad. I can recall a couple of times in my distant past when I've done that myself, maybe unconsciously in response to some perceived pressure to try to fit in? or something?!!

Anyway I'm sure Seibs had doubts when he took the Manly job and he's pretty clearly feeling pressure still. That interview where he mentioned Ukraine and everyone dies! To explain that he didn't feel pressure?? smacked of methinks he doth protest too much!

Nevertheless I can see him getting somewhere and unless there is some outstanding coach suddenly available next year then I can't see any benefit in booting him at the end of this year. we're in the experiment and next year is when it will either fruit or the whole vine will perish.(I've assumed we don't crash and burn this year, but that's still a possibility, sadly)

 

[LeonardCohen]

Rings true. I recall thinking in one or 2 of the early Manly Way films it seemed a bit 'forced' a couple of times when Seibs swore when addressing the squad. I can recall a couple of times in my distant past when I've done that myself, maybe unconsciously in response to some perceived pressure to try to fit in? or something?!!

Anyway I'm sure Seibs had doubts when he took the Manly job and he's pretty clearly feeling pressure still. That interview where he mentioned Ukraine and everyone dies! To explain that he didn't feel pressure?? smacked of methinks he doth protest too much!

Nevertheless I can see him getting somewhere and unless there is some outstanding coach suddenly available next year then I can't see any benefit in booting him at the end of this year. we're in the experiment and next year is when it will either fruit or the whole vine will perish.(I've assumed we don't crash and burn this year, but that's still a possibility, sadly)

Some of his comments were drilling so deep, one could be forgiven for thinking he's in therapy; poor guy.

I agree, we should stick solid until the wheels fall off completely and/or an obvious candidate emerges. The cycle of burning the place down every three years is a privilege reserved for the Tigers.

 

[mave]

He needs a year with a game manager half, that will follow a game plan....which luckily was recruited for next year. Good job Seibs.

My biggest knock on him is not giving the Navales of the world some serious game time this season. Add the bewildering refusal to give Simpkin the #9.

I'm happy to write this year off already, but let's get some legs into next season asap, with these 2 mentioned a rails run for the rest of the year.

Happy to add Patolo, Walsh at 14, in the mix too.

In short, stop being so damn conservative.

 

[Rocky]

He needs a year with a game manager half, that will follow a game plan....which luckily was recruited for next year. Good job Seibs.

My biggest knock on him is not giving the Navales of the world some serious game time this season. Add the bewildering refusal to give Simpkin the #9.

I'm happy to write this year off already, but let's get some legs into next season asap, with these 2 mentioned a rails run for the rest of the year.

Happy to add Patolo, Walsh at 14, in the mix too.

In short, stop being so damn conservative.

Agree with a lot of that - it smells of a man under pressure

I'm no Ricky Stuart fan but he was given the license to rebuild and make longer term decisions...and the results are obvious.

A lot of the Manly decision making has been mainly short sighted.

 

[mave]

Agree with a lot of that - it smells of a man under pressure

I'm no Ricky Stuart fan but he was given the license to rebuild and make longer term decisions...and the results are obvious.

A lot of the Manly decision making has been mainly short sighted.

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