If we had 2 x DCE
- Thread starter maxta
- Start date
DCE is a big reason why our right side has been so weak defensively the last few seasons. For the first half of his career, he had Gifty and Killer on either side of him so yeah that says it all: when surrounded by seasoned pros who are defensively strong, he can capably do his bit (see him at origin, has pretty decent technique etc for a halfback). However, if he must be the player to lead and coordinate his edge, we're ****ed. The solution must be a strong centre outside him, and a weapon 2nd rower inside. Guac is shaping up nicely, we need Koula / Tui or whoever to take ownership of our right side. Problem is, whoever it is will be a rookie and will need time. This won't be a quick fix unfortunately
Ironically, DCE would actually be a more effective defender at 9
Ironically, DCE would actually be a more effective defender at 9
Daly Cherry-Evans
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Moreton than being isolated on an edge?
Yeah, sure he can.
I reckon forward packs would steamroll over us more than they currently do with DCE at hooker. No thanks, hookers need to be good defenders
Technical Coach
Bencher
Ball out in front, running direct and incisive with sharp footwork at the line, squaring his shoulders more to the line helped straighten him up and provide confidence to the outside runners that they wont be cramped up or have to run predictable unders lines.
The angles/approaches DCE was using last night were much better, technically one of his better ball in hand performances i have seen in all his years at Manly.
A pleasure to watch a more technically correct display from DCE with ball in hand even at 34-0, enjoyed that more than the Titans game. I was salivating at the thought of some high quality attacking spreads with a full or almost full squad if DCE continues to play in this more technically correct manner, can't wait.
To me it looked like DCE analyzed last weeks performance or had a deep and meaningful with Garrick to address their timing concerns, maybe one of the support staff in video highlighted some issues to DCE and he took it on board.
The more time DCE has for decision making the more chances he will second guess himself and over complicate the simple, holding off too long and reducing his options with sideways movement.
Playing DCE off second man depth plays for most of his career has stifled his development and given him too much time to think before receiving the pass or too much time to think after receiving the pass. DCE's best plays come from short time frame options or instinctive play, such as quick short side flat plays, playing at the ruck or short and flat near the ruck at speed, snap field goals, snap 40/20's etc etc.
There was a beautiful moment in the first half where he ran direct with a sharp inside step that was incisive and very Foran like at the line, i'm like "about farking tiiiiiiime".
We might just get the best out of DCE in the next 2-3yrs, heres hoping.
The finger pointing laying down the law/expectations motivational speeches right before kick off is pathetic to watch though. No-one takes DCE seriously in that way and i can imagine what was going through the players heads watching their leader dropping and stumbling the first kick off along with not establishing good defensive communication soon after , inspirational stuff not.
The angles/approaches DCE was using last night were much better, technically one of his better ball in hand performances i have seen in all his years at Manly.
A pleasure to watch a more technically correct display from DCE with ball in hand even at 34-0, enjoyed that more than the Titans game. I was salivating at the thought of some high quality attacking spreads with a full or almost full squad if DCE continues to play in this more technically correct manner, can't wait.
To me it looked like DCE analyzed last weeks performance or had a deep and meaningful with Garrick to address their timing concerns, maybe one of the support staff in video highlighted some issues to DCE and he took it on board.
The more time DCE has for decision making the more chances he will second guess himself and over complicate the simple, holding off too long and reducing his options with sideways movement.
Playing DCE off second man depth plays for most of his career has stifled his development and given him too much time to think before receiving the pass or too much time to think after receiving the pass. DCE's best plays come from short time frame options or instinctive play, such as quick short side flat plays, playing at the ruck or short and flat near the ruck at speed, snap field goals, snap 40/20's etc etc.
There was a beautiful moment in the first half where he ran direct with a sharp inside step that was incisive and very Foran like at the line, i'm like "about farking tiiiiiiime".
We might just get the best out of DCE in the next 2-3yrs, heres hoping.
The finger pointing laying down the law/expectations motivational speeches right before kick off is pathetic to watch though. No-one takes DCE seriously in that way and i can imagine what was going through the players heads watching their leader dropping and stumbling the first kick off along with not establishing good defensive communication soon after , inspirational stuff not.
CryingEagle
Member
Would rather 2 walkers over two of jake, Tom or DCE. Walker has been wasted at manly and it’s pretty sad. When he was signed in 2016 I thought we’d win a premiership in the next five years guaranteed. Genuinely disappointed for him and the club.
Nordburg
First Grader
Walker’s time at Manly was encapsulated by his last play on Thursday night,didn’t pass and got injured.Summed up his Manly career perfectly
Technical Coach
Bencher
Walker was developing at 5/8 more than fine, injuries and his off field behaviour stifled his development along with our weak squad and coaching overall.
Prior to last season launching i mentioned that i would prefer Walker as a linkman between Foran and DCE or switch it around and have Foran as the linkman retaining Walker on the left, it was a no brainer to have ballplaying and penetration options all over the park more than any other squad in the comp.
Jake as a linkman is boring as fa&kkk, this fascination of "have a forward take the pressure off the halves and to push the halves on the edges" is pointless if the linkman is not a danger with the ball in hand. Jake doesn't tighten up or keep the middle defences honest allowing teams to just over slide and flood the go to areas with defensive numbers.
Occasionally Jake can put on a nice effective play(especially playing short or back inside) but it is the exception to the rule moment that is placed on a pedestal too often.
Love Jakes effort and mindset but he has too many downsides(in defence and attack) that is taking away from the potential dynamics and evolution of the squad moving forward.
Great clubman but needs to simplify his play, sharpen up in the effort areas of the game and offer hardened inspiration like a Finucane to offer real value to the squad.
Too much cap space is used up on "keep X signed to retain others" or "based on a players potential", it eventually bites you in the back depth wise if you don't have super stars who can elevate others like the Storm have had.
Last edited:
HK_Eagle
First Grader
Completely agree. Why the farrrk are we so fascinated with making a fat a$$ lumbering forward make passes and appear like a playmaker. Just let the bloody playmakers do what they’re best at.
I agree.
It gets hairy on here when you add reasoning that isnt des.
When both jurbo anf turbo take on much of the playmaking roles our halves are more than happy to step aside. Too content for there standing
Especially when you have 4 playmakers in DCE, Foz ,Walker and Schuster. It just wastes tackles when we should be attacking on nearly every play. That's how you get 6 agains and penalties. It's how Penriff and the drizzle roll through teams.
Yes but how much of that is because he doesn't have an inside runner option? He has the energy and will to hit the ball up again and again, he can fling a pass out the back or just take the tackle. If he has someone streaming through on the inside each time that would help, because many times he has shown he can make that play. If Tom's not there there aren't too many others putting their hand up.
In the dead set department manly has the best backer upper in the game. DCE is in the terry lamb stratosphere of backing up and yes that is a wrap. What do you think ?.
Walker could do with more back up also
Im sure you will consider this harsh but who do you have in mind for back up , considering a lot of jakes runs direct the team back into the middle
Currently most of our ouside backs are not guarenteed to be there on a weekly basis and are playing for their spots
Rueben is looking for it more and more each week
How about a second rower?
Not disagreeing but isnt the issue a lack of pace around the ruck, and the pedestrian nature of this tactic , with croker and jake posing little or no threat with their runs ,
Technical Coach
Bencher
Holding the defensive line tight through the middle and around his ballplaying is much easier to do if you have speed, power, footwork and sharpness to take the line on at times, Jake has none of these elements. Defenders can slide to the open side with more confidence that the inside defender even if late on the scene can deal with Jake taking the line on.
Other than Tom and Walker taking on the middle we have no halves doing this(through the middle) other than when sometimes Foran acts as a linkman to a right spread and steps back in at varying times when the pass is not on.
Forans late at the line penetrative ball play on the left is the only consistent quality we offer that holds up under pressure and offers clear cut opportunities every game because Foran is technically correct in his application more often than not-----Bellamy would love Foran at the Storm.
Foran was the only player offering consistent quality involvement against Souths and composed leadership, no other player was inspiring others with their efforts and involvement.(that is not to say there wasn't other good performers but only one was showing quality and leadership)
I didn't expect Foran to ever put in that old school tough as nails approach again to protect his body for longevity, playing really well and giving great value and leadership.
Foran and Tom are the real leaders of the squad where others take notice and be inspired by.
Even with 12 men Manly should of won that game, Souths are very poor at the moment and if it wasn't for some dumb lazy plays through our forwards at bad times Manly could of still controlled the game enough to win.
put croker to centre and koula to the wing. Croker has reasonable speed too.
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