Croker - Honest opinions need apply

[Dee Why Eagle]

Too early to tell but perhaps should hone his organising skills in the lower grades. Not writing him off, just don't think he is ready yet.

Hastings showed, in the brief opportunities he had last year, the organisational skills we so desperately require right NOW. Question is... what is the issue with him??? Can he be a team player???

 

[Ryan]

With this type of player, you have to slowly bring him along. You can't put him directly in the furnace like Barrett has done. He'd be ideal as our number 14 for a few seasons, to develop into a full time role. The problem is though, is that we have limited options (but I hope that's corrected very soon).

Not going to lie, he was MUCH better than I thought he'd be, but the kids out of his depth. The thought's of that Eels backline targeting him next week is scary. Or a team like The Storm or Roosters, kids going to get annialated.

 

[MightyEagles]

Personally I thought for a guy who had previously only played 20mins of first grade he was pretty good. I think when we were shooting for field goal in extra time they should have set Croker for the kick. DCE was always going to be a marked man

 

[HoldenV8]

At times on those switches through the ruck seemed out of sync which will come in time, a prime example was a DCE switch (admittedly the pass was damn high) but Croker had Tom T inside who was 100% into space if the pass was clean....maybe the execution from team mates didn't help at times either, being game 1 timing will ALWAYS be an issue, but seen a few sparks including his support play to suggest this will come good and he is keen.

I still maintain that the pass from DCE was never meant for Croker, it was meant for Thompson on his outside but Croker instinctively reached up and tried to grab it.

 

[HoldenV8]

I do believe that Croker needs more time to develop into someone who can run the team and that he is better off doing it with Blacktown rather than Manly. Hastings may not be everyone's cup of tea, but right now we need an organiser who isn't going to be shy about it and he fits that description.

As it is, last night was Groundhog Day 2016. Too much was left on Cherry's shoulders and it showed. And if we continue to play like last night Croker's confidence won't rise too much.

Look, he's not a bad player and TBH I couldn't fault his defensive work. But he was thrown in the deep end last night and while he didn't exactly drown, I felt like we should have had a few of the Manly lifesavers on standby. And with doesn't-matta next week......we could easily be looking at 0-2.

 

[pjayz]

The best way to judge the success of Croker is to break down DCE's game...

Last night was a return to 2016 DCE...too many touches, trying too hard to make something happen and running around like a headless chook.

Green brought composure, was "on the ball" all of the time and directing the team around. Croker was solid, but he stayed on his edge and failed to command for the ball. We got told he was a genuine half who would direct the team, but he looks to me to be just a "no frills" hang on his own edge and wait, type of half.

We can't afford to go the same way as the Broncos and have a 6 and 7 that run the ball, but can't organise. I cringe when DCE does that running back and forth across thing...you'd never see Cronk or Thurston do that. It happens because Chez is not sure what he is supposed to be doing. It's being made up on the spot. That's a massive concern to me.

Interesting, I thought you said previously that people were over stating Green’s organising role and his influence on DCE and that it would be good for DCE to take on more organising this year?

I agree with your comments that DCE looked like a headless chook at times. I’ve always subscribed to DCE being more a runner/ play what is in front of him type (which still allows for a heap of try assists) - not the type of player that can really run a team around the park and direct the play.

Out of the players in the Comp, Cleary would be ideal for Cherry - he is the one we should be targeting if there is any chance we could afford him. Penrith will struggle to keep him if the current unrest remains.

Cleary is probably out of our price range, but boy wouldn’t he be perfect for us in more ways than one. If we were to go all in for a player - he would be my pick.

I think we have the right pack (if Tanginoa and Lane can play consistently like they did last night). Walker coming back will add spark - we just need the right half.

 

[winnyason]

The best way to judge the success of Croker is to break down DCE's game...

Last night was a return to 2016 DCE...too many touches, trying too hard to make something happen and running around like a headless chook.

Green brought composure, was "on the ball" all of the time and directing the team around. Croker was solid, but he stayed on his edge and failed to command for the ball. We got told he was a genuine half who would direct the team, but he looks to me to be just a "no frills" hang on his own edge and wait, type of half.

We can't afford to go the same way as the Broncos and have a 6 and 7 that run the ball, but can't organise. I cringe when DCE does that running back and forth across thing...you'd never see Cronk or Thurston do that. It happens because Chez is not sure what he is supposed to be doing. It's being made up on the spot. That's a massive concern to me.

Yeah dce overplayed his hand. We attempted zero 40/20s and repeat sets minimal.
Lachlan not ready imo, great he solid and can defend but he does not demand ball.
Hastings has that air of arrogance to want the ball he played well in nsw cup yesterday.

 

[HoldenV8]

Unfortunately, there is a reason why DCE didn't excel whenever he started for Qld alongside Thurston. There is a reason why his game suffered during the falied Walker experiment and its the same reason why he was running around like a headless chook last night.

He can't organise the team's attack, simple as that. He's a ball runner who plays what's in front of him.

Why do you think we went so hard after Lamb, then Pearce, then Hodkinson and even Carney despite Baz constantly telling everyone that Croker was becoming his first choice? Because their style of game would allow DCE to run the ball without the burden of having to organise the attack.

As it is we've thrown the ball to a kid with very little in the way of first grade experience and unless he gets a handle on running the team soon, we're going to be in trouble and all the so-called experts pre-season predictions about us missing the Finals are going to look close to the mark.

I know everyone has to start somewhere, but to put a second game player straight into the NRL halves and expect him to run the team is fraught with danger. I'd still prefer Hastings at 5/8 and to bring Croker along slowly, maybe as the bench utility where he could cover backs and hooker while getting solid first grade experience without the higher expectation. Even Foran played a season or so in the centres before he was moved permanently to 5/8.

 

[sheridanstand78]

I was impressed. Work in progress. There were some good signs. We need him and others to take the heat off DCE.

 

[swoop]

You can't judge him in one game because it's not just about Croker it's the combination between, Croker, DCE and the Turbo's. Our pack out muscled their pack it'll take time. I wished they'd kept Watson at 5/8th because when Lamb came on the field they looked a far better. We should have won that game.

 

[Budgie]

I thought his use of the bench was excellent ...

Who would you have taken off to put Brown or Winterstein on for?..

and when would you have done it?

It was the composition of the bench that was the problem.

 

[Simonmyers11]

Thought he did ok. Better attacker, runner and defencively than green, just needs time to demand more ball and organise the team. Green was a veteran, Crocker is a rookie! Pretty good for 2nd NRL game. Feel pretty safe out there with him defending with Thompson. A lot more starch there than last year.

Give him time, needs to work on his combination with API. I suspect will take pretty much a whole season to start to gel and demand more ball and take control of organising the team.

 

[Simonmyers11]

Unfortunately, there is a reason why DCE didn't excel whenever he started for Qld alongside Thurston. There is a reason why his game suffered during the falied Walker experiment and its the same reason why he was running around like a headless chook last night.

He can't organise the team's attack, simple as that. He's a ball runner who plays what's in front of him.

Why do you think we went so hard after Lamb, then Pearce, then Hodkinson and even Carney despite Baz constantly telling everyone that Croker was becoming his first choice? Because their style of game would allow DCE to run the ball without the burden of having to organise the attack.

As it is we've thrown the ball to a kid with very little in the way of first grade experience and unless he gets a handle on running the team soon, we're going to be in trouble and all the so-called experts pre-season predictions about us missing the Finals are going to look close to the mark.

I know everyone has to start somewhere, but to put a second game player straight into the NRL halves and expect him to run the team is fraught with danger. I'd still prefer Hastings at 5/8 and to bring Croker along slowly, maybe as the bench utility where he could cover backs and hooker while getting solid first grade experience without the higher expectation. Even Foran played a season or so in the centres before he was moved permanently to 5/8.

Hastings can organise a team. Watched him play a lot and is a big talker and directs play and can kick.

You would think going forward having one of those two on the bench would be better suited than brown.

 

[Woodsie]

It was the composition of the bench that was the problem.

I agree ... not the bench I would have chosen either. But apart from rotation you need to also over for possible injuries, without knowing who may get injured.

My defence of Barrett is more in response to the criticism he was copping for not using everyone on the bench.

 

[BOZO]

I do believe that Croker needs more time to develop into someone who can run the team and that he is better off doing it with Blacktown rather than Manly. Hastings may not be everyone's cup of tea, but right now we need an organiser who isn't going to be shy about it and he fits that description.

As it is, last night was Groundhog Day 2016. Too much was left on Cherry's shoulders and it showed. And if we continue to play like last night Croker's confidence won't rise too much.

Look, he's not a bad player and TBH I couldn't fault his defensive work. But he was thrown in the deep end last night and while he didn't exactly drown, I felt like we should have had a few of the Manly lifesavers on standby. And with doesn't-matta next week......we could easily be looking at 0-2.

I did not see the game but the fact is that Croker has had only one NRL game experience back in 2016 and you are right mate it will take time and time could cost us competition points

 

[Captain Moondog]

Early days for Croker, I feel he'll improve on last night (and he'll need to).

 

[Spartan Eagle]

I think it's too early to tell. He certainly didn't play that organisational style of game that we're accustomed from Green.. But perhaps we did him no favours by wrapping him up in cotton wool with our game plan. It's been evident leading up to this game that we've said we don't want to put too much pressure on him, get turbo involved with kicking, spread the load, take a safe approach etc..the game plan was cherrygraphed.
If you are going to put him in that position then let him take some of the reigns.. Sink or swim. You'll find that a lot of elite athletes rise to the occasion..

 

[Terry Zarsoff]

I think the 2011 season is a good starting point. A lot of people on here at the time were writing the Manly team off after a loss to Melbourne, the latter at home. On the night a new halfback debuted for the Manly team. He’s still there.

Sure, that 2011 side had a better all round look than the current outfit; but there are still seven current or former Aus/NZ internationals in the current squad, so it certainly looks promising.

 

[Budgie]

Does anyone really know what the problem with Hastings is?
I
Just
Don't
Get
It.
Theatre companies, opera companies, orchestras are renowned for divas, squabbles, all-out wars. Yet, they get through performances, having to rely completely on each other to give a great performance. The audience is never any the wiser.
Yet Hastings is supposed to be so difficult that these big, bloody, boofy blokes might be put off their games by his mere presence?
Please.
He scored two tries in the early game and generally played well and he has much more experience than the Canberra rookie.
Anybody?

 

[Woodsie]

Does anyone really know what the problem with Hastings is?
I
Just
Don't
Get
It.
Theatre companies, opera companies, orchestras are renowned for divas, squabbles, all-out wars. Yet, they get through performances, having to rely completely on each other to give a great performance. The audience is never any the wiser.
Yet Hastings is supposed to be so difficult that these big, bloody, boofy blokes might be put off their games by his mere presence?
Please.
He scored two tries in the early game and generally played well and he has much more experience than the Canberra rookie.
Anybody?

Not me ... I got nothing ....