Deleted

[SeaEagleRock8]

Section 32 is just another way the courts can discharge a matter with ‘no conviction recorded’. There are heaps of them - S.9 and S.10 are the most well known, 9 being a good behaviour bond, 10 generally being the first/minor offence for a cleanskin. It’s kind of the court version of letting you off with a warning.

There seems to be a lot of confusion about what the ‘mental health’ thing actually means; it’s not a *defence* to a charge (I think people are seeing it as some sort of ‘diminished responsibility’ plea, which it’s not). It’s basically saying “yes, I did it, I take responsibility for it, but here is a mitigating factor for the court to consider when deciding the punishment”, that’s all. And S.32 covers everything from learning difficulties, anxiety, depression, autism spectrum disorder etc

I would suggest if there wasn’t something that gave Fainu the option of a discharge under S.32, they’d be asking for an S.10 (maybe a 9) anyway. Really the only difference is, if he has a diagnosis that fits
S.32 criteria, it’s a little bit more ‘evidence’ for no conviction to be recorded, whereas 10/9 is purely just ‘I’m a good boy/I promise I’ll be a good boy, please don’t record a conviction against me’.

No, section 32 does not require a plea to be entered and definitely does not require an acceptance of the facts. Yes some defendants may say “yes, I did it, I take responsibility for it' but others do not, and if the court declines to deal with the matter under section 32 then you can still plead not guilty and get a hearing on the evidence.
As for Fainu I have no idea if he entered a guilty plea, I haven't seen that reported anywhere.

(Also, section 9 is a good behaviour bond with conviction, not without. Section 10 is no conviction and can be with or without a bond)

 

[Bearfax]

Section 32 is just another way the courts can discharge a matter with ‘no conviction recorded’. There are heaps of them - S.9 and S.10 are the most well known, 9 being a good behaviour bond, 10 generally being the first/minor offence for a cleanskin. It’s kind of the court version of letting you off with a warning.

There seems to be a lot of confusion about what the ‘mental health’ thing actually means; it’s not a *defence* to a charge (I think people are seeing it as some sort of ‘diminished responsibility’ plea, which it’s not). It’s basically saying “yes, I did it, I take responsibility for it, but here is a mitigating factor for the court to consider when deciding the punishment”, that’s all. And S.32 covers everything from learning difficulties, anxiety, depression, autism spectrum disorder etc

I would suggest if there wasn’t something that gave Fainu the option of a discharge under S.32, they’d be asking for an S.10 (maybe a 9) anyway. Really the only difference is, if he has a diagnosis that fits
S.32 criteria, it’s a little bit more ‘evidence’ for no conviction to be recorded, whereas 10/9 is purely just ‘I’m a good boy/I promise I’ll be a good boy, please don’t record a conviction against me’.

Excellent Yoka. That's what I wanted you to clarify. You obviously have some legal background, but I was thinking many on this site may not have understood what those terms meant. Thanks for elaborating.

 

[XV-1]

Mate we were all horny buggers at his age and some still are .

What has being horny got to do with some disgusting grub posting having sex with a girl on public media.

I am afraid if proven guilty he should be rubbed out for a long time, if not forever.

 

[The Who]

Hey all,

1. I have been informed by a close relative of Moses Suli that he has been offered a three year extension by TB. This relative also told me that Suli has expressed his happiness at Manly, with words to the effect of, “he loves the boys and reckons the team environment is head and shoulders above the Dogs and Tigers.” Relative said Suli is going to put pen to paper and could happen within the next month. So that’s something positive I guess.

.

Dear Joel,
You are forbidden on this Forum to post anything positive about TB or the spirit he has engendered in the players.
This is your first, and last, warning.

 

[yokahontas]

No, section 32 does not require a plea to be entered and definitely does not require an acceptance of the facts. Yes some defendants may say “yes, I did it, I take responsibility for it' but others do not, and if the court declines to deal with the matter under section 32 then you can still plead not guilty and get a hearing on the evidence.
As for Fainu I have no idea if he entered a guilty plea, I haven't seen that reported anywhere.

(Also, section 9 is a good behaviour bond with conviction, not without. Section 10 is no conviction and can be with or without a bond)

Sorry mate, blame it on 3am - what I should have said was, it’s another of the myriad alternate ways a charge can be dealt with and discharged without using the ‘normal’ options (and yes, I did know S.9 gets a conviction recorded, as do community service orders etc) I stand corrected on where the conviction/no conviction stuff comes in.

@Bearfax my background is on the health side, not the legal side. It grinds my gears a bit that people are carrying on about ‘shouldn’t play if he’s using mental health in court’, as if whatever the guy is diagnosed with either makes him an imminent danger to everyone around him at all times, or is something that you can just put your life on hold while you fix up, then go back to doing your thing.

I know the official health/legal documents get confusing, but we are talking stuff like learning difficulties, autism etc coming under this umbrella - stuff that is lifelong, incurable, and you just learn to adjust and adapt to throughout your life. In many cases, also conditions that most people would really not know you have unless you tell them (autism isn’t all Rainman, rocking in a foetal position and screeching incoherently, for example. Plenty of people on the spectrum living ‘normal’ lives, with jobs, families, hobbies etc as we speak. Statistically speaking, good chance there’s at least one or two players with ASD running around in the NRL right now, and I’d put money on it plenty of other assorted conditions that would fall under the MH banner as well).

Having a condition that falls under the ‘mental health’ umbrella doesn’t make you an acutely psychotic axe murderer in waiting!

 

[Cameron]

Sorry guys hating being the bearer of bad news but Fainu will not be at
Manly next year. He’s off to Japan the
Link below confirms it.

http://www.ibtimes.com.au/japan-bad...-gender-imbalance-adult-film-industry-1522691

 

[mave]

Trenty boy could land a new gig there, easy.

 

[Bearfax]

Sorry mate, blame it on 3am - what I should have said was, it’s another of the myriad alternate ways a charge can be dealt with and discharged without using the ‘normal’ options (and yes, I did know S.9 gets a conviction recorded, as do community service orders etc) I stand corrected on where the conviction/no conviction stuff comes in.

@Bearfax my background is on the health side, not the legal side. It grinds my gears a bit that people are carrying on about ‘shouldn’t play if he’s using mental health in court’, as if whatever the guy is diagnosed with either makes him an imminent danger to everyone around him at all times, or is something that you can just put your life on hold while you fix up, then go back to doing your thing.

I know the official health/legal documents get confusing, but we are talking stuff like learning difficulties, autism etc coming under this umbrella - stuff that is lifelong, incurable, and you just learn to adjust and adapt to throughout your life. In many cases, also conditions that most people would really not know you have unless you tell them (autism isn’t all Rainman, rocking in a foetal position and screeching incoherently, for example. Plenty of people on the spectrum living ‘normal’ lives, with jobs, families, hobbies etc as we speak. Statistically speaking, good chance there’s at least one or two players with ASD running around in the NRL right now, and I’d put money on it plenty of other assorted conditions that would fall under the MH banner as well).

Having a condition that falls under the ‘mental health’ umbrella doesn’t make you an acutely psychotic axe murderer in waiting!

Thanks Yoka. I suspected you were in the legal arena. Health was my second guess. I was in parole, working in the community, courts and gaols with offenders. Had a lot to do with the mental health teams mainly in the south west of Sydney. Over worked, under staffed and dealing with some very difficult clients. You've got my vote.

 

[yokahontas]

Thanks Yoka. I suspected you were in the legal arena. Health was my second guess. I was in parole, working in the community, courts and gaols with offenders. Had a lot to do with the mental health teams mainly in the south west of Sydney. Over worked, under staffed and dealing with some very difficult clients. You've got my vote.

Can’t disagree with you there, and it’s hard to know what the solution is in a lot of cases. At the very least, removing some of the stigma around mental health issues (like the MH diagnosis = can’t/shouldn’t be allowed to live/work a normal life out in the community) might lead more people to get some help, either for themselves or their family members, before it becomes an acute problem for emergency services to try and deal with at 3am on a Sunday, often in a remote town with limited ambulance/police resources on duty (or on call after already working a 12+ hour day).

I think people would be shocked if they knew the number of emergency vehicles/personnel that are out of circulation at any given time dealing with mental health crises that could’ve been headed off with some early intervention.

I’ve also done a fair bit of work with kids with special needs over the years (a lot with autism). The situation has improved, but there are still parents who flat refuse to admit their child has an issue that they need help with, whether it’s because of a social stigma, cultural factors, religious ones, whatever. Head in the sand denying there’s anything *wrong* with little Johnny helps nobody, least of all little Johnny, who might have a shot at a decent life with the right kind of early intervention.

/endrant

 

[niccipops]

I’ve also done a fair bit of work with kids with special needs over the years (a lot with autism). The situation has improved, but there are still parents who flat refuse to admit their child has an issue that they need help with, whether it’s because of a social stigma, cultural factors, religious ones, whatever. Head in the sand denying there’s anything *wrong* with little Johnny helps nobody, least of all little Johnny, who might have a shot at a decent life with the right kind of early intervention.

/endrant

Absolutely right. There are many children in need with parents who refuse to seek a diagnosis. It's can be confusing because a diagnosis means funding, action, resources including human ones.
I also see is plenty of is medically unqualified people throwing labels around left, right and centre as an excuse for negative behaviours.
It's a strange mix.

 

[Harvies elbow]

Can’t disagree with you there, and it’s hard to know what the solution is in a lot of cases. At the very least, removing some of the stigma around mental health issues (like the MH diagnosis = can’t/shouldn’t be allowed to live/work a normal life out in the community) might lead more people to get some help, either for themselves or their family members, before it becomes an acute problem for emergency services to try and deal with at 3am on a Sunday, often in a remote town with limited ambulance/police resources on duty (or on call after already working a 12+ hour day).

I think people would be shocked if they knew the number of emergency vehicles/personnel that are out of circulation at any given time dealing with mental health crises that could’ve been headed off with some early intervention.

I’ve also done a fair bit of work with kids with special needs over the years (a lot with autism). The situation has improved, but there are still parents who flat refuse to admit their child has an issue that they need help with, whether it’s because of a social stigma, cultural factors, religious ones, whatever. Head in the sand denying there’s anything *wrong* with little Johnny helps nobody, least of all little Johnny, who might have a shot at a decent life with the right kind of early intervention.

/endrant

Ok yoka, time to come clean and reveal your true identity.
Horace Rumpole come on down....

 

[Dee Why Eagle]

Can’t disagree with you there, and it’s hard to know what the solution is in a lot of cases. At the very least, removing some of the stigma around mental health issues (like the MH diagnosis = can’t/shouldn’t be allowed to live/work a normal life out in the community) might lead more people to get some help, either for themselves or their family members, before it becomes an acute problem for emergency services to try and deal with at 3am on a Sunday, often in a remote town with limited ambulance/police resources on duty (or on call after already working a 12+ hour day).

I think people would be shocked if they knew the number of emergency vehicles/personnel that are out of circulation at any given time dealing with mental health crises that could’ve been headed off with some early intervention.

I’ve also done a fair bit of work with kids with special needs over the years (a lot with autism). The situation has improved, but there are still parents who flat refuse to admit their child has an issue that they need help with, whether it’s because of a social stigma, cultural factors, religious ones, whatever. Head in the sand denying there’s anything *wrong* with little Johnny helps nobody, least of all little Johnny, who might have a shot at a decent life with the right kind of early intervention.

/endrant

tough gig

 

[Freagle]

Well I still have mixed thoughts about Manase Fainu and what he did, but I have renewed respect for several of my fellow forum members, whose depth of knowledge and experience has impressed.

Fainu - I'm tempted to put it down to youthful stupidity, but then I've never been a teenage girl being objectified on social media. If he was from the Eastern Beaches he'd be sent off to a rehab clinic in Thailand for a few weeks then welcomed back as a 'changed character'...in the real world he needs one of the Tongan community elders to let him know very clearly that this behaviour doesn't belong in the community he feels strongly about, and his aunts, sisters, grandparents etc are ashamed of him. I grew up with friends from several very strong Tongan families around the Manly area, and those that held the most traditional beliefs and family values were by far the most well-adjusted, including some who played lower-grades for the Eagles and other sides. Then those whose families had moved away from the community ended up playing at dumb-ass gangster ****, and lost respect/ended up in gaol. Could go either way, but at least he has Islander role models at the club.

 

[MadMarcus]

Sorry guys hating being the bearer of bad news but Fainu will not be at
Manly next year. He’s off to Japan the
Link below confirms it.

http://www.ibtimes.com.au/japan-bad...-gender-imbalance-adult-film-industry-1522691

#metoo

 

[MadMarcus]

Clearly there’s some pretty good knowledge of the criminal justice system in here, but we’ll never match the Eels for first hand experience