It’s official... Des can coach....

[47MVEagle]

... and we had The Shoe, Harpo, Guaca and Sippers picked in reserve grade.

Because they'd had little to zero game time in 2020.

 

[47MVEagle]

Olakau'atu play 5 games last year FYI............from your comments

Haumole - played no games last year, suffered dislocated elbow in first BWSE game of the season so was unavailable until recovered.

Where did he play?

You're not thinking of 2019 are you?

EDIT: I just checked his wikipedia page & while it only shows he played 12 games in 2019 in the table, it mentions at the end that he played 5 games in 2020.

I don't remember him ever playing first grade last year?

EDIT 2: okay, I've just gone through the team lists for every round last year & he was on the bench in rounds 1 & 2, started in round 13 (& scored a try vs Warriors), on the bench again for rounds 14 & 20.

 

[The Who]

Because they'd had little to zero game time in 2020.

I take you point. But if I'm correct:
The Shoe was in First Grade until his injury late in the season, and showed he was up to NRL standard so shouldn't he have started in the top grade where he had finished?
Harpo was in First Grade for the final 4-5 matches so he was an incumbent and the shining light in the trial match with the Tugers.
Anybody who had watched Guaca play could see his talent had eclipsed that of old favourite Sir Loin....

Anyway, that's all ancient history. The 'new' players have superseded the established players in their positions and our backline is now resembling the marvellous Manly backlines of old.

 

[Shoe1]

Where did he play?

You're not thinking of 2019 are you?

EDIT: I just checked his wikipedia page & while it only shows he played 12 games in 2019 in the table, it mentions at the end that he played 5 games in 2020.

I don't remember him ever playing first grade last year?

Haumole played 1st grade against the warriors last year, went very well. I think it was the same game as the schu.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

He played rounds 1, 2, 13, 14 and 20 [RL Player project]

 

[47MVEagle]

Haumole played 1st grade against the warriors last year, went very well. I think it was the same game as the schu.

Yep, I just edited my post again. He played twice against the Warriors in rounds 13 & 20.

 

[47MVEagle]

I take you point. But if I'm correct:
The Shoe was in First Grade until his injury late in the season, and showed he was up to NRL standard so shouldn't he have started in the top grade where he had finished?
Harpo was in First Grade for the final 4-5 matches so he was an incumbent and the shining light in the trial match with the Tugers.
Anybody who had watched Guaca play could see his talent had eclipsed that of old favourite Sir Loin....

Anyway, that's all ancient history. The 'new' players have superseded the established players in their positions and our backline is now resembling the marvellous Manly backlines of old.

Schuster only played one first grade game in 2020 - his debut against the Tigers, & also the game he got injured in.

By all accounts he was to be our next 5/8th but I assume Des thought it would be better for him to learn the craft from (& alongside) someone like Foran.

I agree on Harper, I thought he showed enough in his handful of games last year to be a starter from round 1 this year.

 

[Will on the hill]

Our wins have come against Warriorsx2, Broncos, Tigers, Titans. Our losses against Penrithx2 Roosters Bunnies, Dragons.

All wins vs bottom 9 teams, all losses vs top 6.
I think who our opposition was has played the biggest part in our perceived turnaround. Followed very closely by Turbo's return.

Sundays game will be a good indicator of just how much we have improved.

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

Are you suggesting that for the previous 15 games before we starting winning .. he was coaching a bad defensive system and that during that time he also had no loyalty ?

PSS ... I agree our defensive structures have improved greatly ..

Certainly saying that the up and in defensive pattern I believe was poor for the players we had. Now injuries obviously meant that some of those players were playing First Grade when they shouldn't have been. I probably agree that we should have blooded Shu and Guac earlier and stuck with Guac after his first game... that to me was clearly a Des faux pas. Also my strong view is that we were caught pure and simple last year by the changing rules without any ability for any team to plan to change their roster and with Jetski, Boyle and Waddell just as examples - totally out of their depth in this new game of "touch" and with Turbo's injury we were just dead in the water. So not sure that is all on Des - before the sudden rule changes and based on our 2019 form I think he and we all could have been very confident of finishing in the top four or close to it with a healthy roster, Turbo playing and the previous style that was League where our grind them into the ground game was a winning formula. You can't grind teams into the ground since the beginning of 2020 - you need mobile, quick players. One of the best things Barrett did was sign Waddell - pity he didn't sign Jetski and Boyle as well.

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

Loyalty is huge. The new defensive structure seems to be working a treat as well - happy days.

agreed on both - I think slide if it is implemented correctly is a great defensive pattern

 

[Woodsie]

Also my strong view is that we were caught pure and simple last year by the changing rules without any ability for any team to plan to change their roster and with Jetski, Boyle and Waddell just as examples - totally out of their depth in this new game of "touch"

Not having a go at you Brissie Tragic ... from your posts you obviously have a good grasp of the game ... but to use your own comment ... Dessie continued to play those 3 players you said were out of their depth ... and that is on him .. and continued to use a defensive pattern that as you suggest didn't suit our players (or the new game) ... and other clubs in the same boat adjusted much faster ...

Put as I have always said ... it doesn't matter if you come to Jesus late ... as long as you get there ... cheers

 

[Brisbane Tragic]

Not having a go at you Brissie Tragic ... from your posts you obviously have a good grasp of the game ... but to use your own comment ... Dessie continued to play those 3 players you said were out of their depth ... and that is on him .. and continued to use a defensive pattern that as you suggest didn't suit our players (or the new game) ... and other clubs in the same boat adjusted much faster ...

Put as I have always said ... it doesn't matter if you come to Jesus late ... as long as you get there ... cheers

Um... yes but with injuries we were stuffed although as I said not sure why he didn't play Guac and Schu earlier - again as I said that is on Des. Defensive system... no way you can change that during a season. You saw what a shambles our slide defence was for the first 4 games - a lot also to do with a lack of confidence and Turbo missing but also to do with trying to bed in a brand new system which they had been working on all off season. So they were stuck with up and in last year. Not sure what systems the other clubs had defensive wise. I am guessing mostly slide? Also as I said our game was built on the grinding game.... wear them down. Most of the other top sides were different - very flashy and so the new game suited them much better and us less so. Just my view.

 

[Freddo]

Lots of people using IMO on here, nobody should get miffed or upset if they read the definition of the word below.
OPINION::a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge.
or
a statement of advice by an expert on a professional matter.

I think we have a good mix of both on here. Gives you a choice.

 

[Kevinward777]

Our wins have come against Warriorsx2, Broncos, Tigers, Titans. Our losses against Penrithx2 Roosters Bunnies, Dragons.

All wins vs bottom 9 teams, all losses vs top 6.
I think who our opposition was has played the biggest part in our perceived turnaround. Followed very closely by Turbo's return.

Sundays game will be a good indicator of just how much we have improved.

The second game against Penrith was a good indication of how much we have improved. It was a stronger line up than the team who flogged us at Brookvale as well. Api and Edwards both played the second time around.

 

[JenEagle]

extend his contract by 5 years now

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

This was the first round squad, and their current status for the next round.

1Dylan Walker (injured - unavailable)
2Jason Saab
3Brad Parker
4Moses Suli (injured previously - bench)
5Reuben Garrick
6Kieran Foran (injured - unavailable)
7Daly Cherry-Evans
8Josh Aloiai (injured - unavailable)
9Lachlan Croker
10Martin Taupau
11Jack Gosiewski (injured - unavailable)
12Curtis Sironen (injured - unavailable)
13Jake Trbojevic

14Tevita Funa (available - not picked)
15Andrew Davey (injured - unavailable)
16Morgan Boyle (injured - unavailable)
17Taniela Paseka

IMO our current seventeen is the reason we are performing at a much higher level then we did in the first found rounds. Clearly, the only reason we have our current seventeen is because of injuries.

I agree with XV-1 EXCEPT on Croker who has improved massively since the early rounds. Obviously Turbo has been a huge difference since he came back, and is definitely the most influential player in the NRL. BUT out of the first round team (assuming they are all available - plus Turbo/Fainu/Lawton), I cant find a place for many of the currently injured players. Obviously Turbo and Fainu are one and nine, Foran is six, Aloiai is fifteen and potentially Lawton is fourteen. The rest should be fighting for a spot in the seventeen. (Perhaps Walker for Parker, Davey for Sipley etc)

I actually prefer the balance of our current seventeen as is. This seventeen wouldnt have happened except for the injuries that have occurred along the way. Arguably, Des planned to bring these players through anyway (Schuster, Harper, Keppie, Sipley, Haumole, Cust, Saddler) BUT he didn't pick them in the first round, in the first seventeen.

Read into this whatever you want, but you cannot argue this team wasn't how Des originally chose our original 2021 starting lineup. Its clearly very different now to what it was back then. Clearly its also performing much better then the first round team.
Funny that ...................

...I read into your post as again only injuries have led us to this point.

We played the roosters, panthers, Rabbits and our bogey side the dragqueens in the first 4 rounds. There is absolutely no proof it would have been any different had Des rolled out the under 20 side that you and a few others wax lyrical about.

I back the guy who's won multiple and been a proven winner for more years than many on here have had hot breakfasts.

I would go so far as to say the development of these kids would have been put back weeks if not months had the copped some absolute hidings in those early rounds.

But again what would know. Im apprently just a blind disciple of an out of touch dinosaur who cant coach and should have retired years ago.....

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

Beautifully argued. It is what I believe and have been trying to say but without the evidence you have listed.
DESpicable might be able to coach, as the heading of this thread announces, but his judgement on player talent in the early rounds was way off the mark.

Again says who?

I give you an alternate timeline.

Des plays the kids as many wanted in those first 4 rounds. They get just as hammered as the old guys did. Round 5 or 6 comes along and the injuries come to keppie, Gauc and co and a few get dropped for form issues. In come sirro, suli and others.

TOM RETURNS

We start winning a few with the old boys back. Not as well. Not by as much but still winning so what then?

The kids who are killing it now are playing in regies. We are winning some and loosing some and going ok.

Im 100% behind have we have brought people in this year which looks to be paying big time now.

 

[Eagles4Life]

...I read into your post as again only injuries have led us to this point.

We played the roosters, panthers, Rabbits and our bogey side the dragqueens in the first 4 rounds. There is absolutely no proof it would have been any different had Des rolled out the under 20 side that you and a few others wax lyrical about.

I back the guy who's won multiple and been a proven winner for more years than many on here have had hot breakfasts.

I would go so far as to say the development of these kids would have been put back weeks if not months had the copped some absolute hidings in those early rounds.

But again what would know. Im apprently just a blind disciple of an out of touch dinosaur who cant coach and should have retired years ago.....

Back here again. I could also try to rehash, reimagine and reinterprete historical events to suit an agenda through the prism of hindsight. I might do that tomorrow. Right now I am more interested in celebrating another Manly win by the current Manly seventeen. Therefore I will just repeat the last paragraph of my original post.

Read into this whatever you want, but you cannot argue this team wasn't how Des originally chose our original 2021 starting lineup. Its clearly very different now to what it was back then. Clearly its also performing much better then the first round team.
Funny that ...................

The key bit is
Read into this whatever you want.........

 

[EOL now nesting on the GC]

Back here again. I could also try to rehash, reimagine and reinterprete historical events to suit an agenda through the prism of hindsight. I might do that tomorrow. Right now I am more interested in celebrating another Manly win by the current Manly seventeen. Therefore I will just repeat the last paragraph of my original post.

Read into this whatever you want, but you cannot argue this team wasn't how Des originally chose our original 2021 starting lineup. Its clearly very different now to what it was back then. Clearly its also performing much better then the first round team.
Funny that ...................

The key bit is
Read into this whatever you want.........

nice repeat but it doesn't change facts.

we lost 4 miserably after a very bad end to 2020. we had injuries. the young kids came in at exactly the same time TURBO returned and its turned out sweet.

Those same kids could have been selected round 1. perhaps hammered perhaps not and we could be in a very different position today.

Lets set out our stalls.

you say luck and good timing.

I say the old guy can still coach and given he's not on here typing away and instead winning matches we can agree to disagree.

enjoy the ride as Des hopefully takes this side deep into the finals on luck and good fortune.

 

[The Who]

The defence was amazing today. DESpicable must have played a mighty part in getting every player to buy into the Manly stoicism of old. It gladdens the heart to see every player guarding the tryline like their lives depended on it.
We look like we have our team back, and it feels wonderful.