Jake.! Jake.!! Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaake.!!!

[Ryan]

Random Stats Guy (well worth a follow on Insta) is doing a top 100 players in the game based on statistical output atm.

Jakey in at 94.

Stats alone don't tell a full story but thought people might like a snapshot of Jakes last 3 years

94 out of 289 (17 players X 17 teams) isn't too bad mate. Unsure if it's a critique, praise, or just info in your post? But yeah, top 30% in the league is pretty handy.

 

[Pete W]

Random Stats Guy (well worth a follow on Insta) is doing a top 100 players in the game based on statistical output atm.

Jakey in at 94.

Stats alone don't tell a full story but thought people might like a snapshot of Jakes last 3 years

Yet another perfect example of why stats can be almost meaningless at times

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

94 out of 289 (17 players X 17 teams) isn't too bad mate. Unsure if it's a critique, praise, or just info in your post? But yeah, top 30% in the league is pretty handy.

Considering he's regularly picked for Origin he's pretty clearly in the top 30 or so. The random stats guy is just showing the weakness of his stats analysis.

 

[Pete W]

I'm shocked at those stats. All 80 min players too.

Happy to eat humble pie.

Wow for the amount all those blokes touch the ball. And it 4 or 5 hit ups a half. Wow.

These elite locks are selected for their defensive capabilities first and foremost. They are not supposed to be using energy for hit ups. They are there primarily to secure their team's middle third all game, every game - probably the single most important role in a rugby league team.

A secondary responsibility is to coordinate and link ball movement across the park between the ruck and edge playmakers.

These guys must be the fittest, toughest, technically astute guys in the team. But they are not there for runs and metres gained. That's the job of the battering rams (props) and wingers!

 

[BOZO]

Yet another perfect example of why stats can be almost meaningless at times

One of the most saddest stats is to be hailed a Manly King without a Manly Premiership Winning Crown .

 

[Disco]

94 out of 289 (17 players X 17 teams) isn't too bad mate. Unsure if it's a critique, praise, or just info in your post? But yeah, top 30% in the league is pretty handy.

Neither, just sharing a snapshot of his last 3 years stats for anyone who is interested.

 

[Disco]

Yet another perfect example of why stats can be almost meaningless at times

Considering he's regularly picked for Origin he's pretty clearly in the top 30 or so. The random stats guy is just showing the weakness of his stats analysis.

He's not rating the best players in the game nor is he claiming Jake is bad, good, amazing, awful or anything else.

Just doing a list on statistical output.

I think everyone recognises stats arent the be all and end all, if they were players like Cronk and Foran wouldn’t rate a mention as players.

Its just some interesting info

 

[Technical Coach]

These elite locks are selected for their defensive capabilities first and foremost. They are not supposed to be using energy for hit ups. They are there primarily to secure their team's middle third all game, every game - probably the single most important role in a rugby league team.

A secondary responsibility is to coordinate and link ball movement across the park between the ruck and edge playmakers.

These guys must be the fittest, toughest, technically astute guys in the team. But they are not there for runs and metres gained. That's the job of the battering rams (props) and wingers!

And when you are that one dimensional and respected too much for one element of the game you build a squad that is consistently middle of the road---especially when your impact on the salary cap is too much.

The best modern teams in pretty much all team sports are filled with squads that have less one dimensional "role players" in their lineups, the skill gap and speed differences are narrowing from the best to the worst especially in the last 10-15yrs of team sports.

Sure role players will always exist but let's not over hype it's benefits especially in the modern game.

Post greatly edited down not to offend or come across too arrogant lol.

Sign up to my patreon page for more in-depth dribble.

 

[Pete W]

And when you are that one dimensional and respected too much for one element of the game you build a squad that is consistently middle of the road---especially when your impact on the salary cap is too much.

The best modern teams in pretty much all team sports are filled with squads that have less one dimensional "role players" in their lineups, the skill gap and speed differences are narrowing from the best to the worst especially in the last 10-15yrs of team sports.

Sure role players will always exist but let's not over hype it's benefits especially in the modern game.

Post greatly edited down not to offend or come across too arrogant lol.

Sign up to my patreon page for more in-depth dribble.

Sorry mate but if that's not dribble, not sure what is (no offence intended!)

So if a player is both one dimensional and also respected, then the whole squad becomes average? What?? Does not a hooker have a specific "role" to do? Or should all players be servicing the ruck? Why don't we just swap halfback and prop from time to time?

(Btw, back to my original point, considering locks play 80min, why are none of them in the top 10 for metres gained? Only Yeoh and Carrigan make top 20, and only 2 more in top 50. I.e. less than 10% of NRL's biggest runners are locks)

 

[BOZO]

And when you are that one dimensional and respected too much for one element of the game you build a squad that is consistently middle of the road---especially when your impact on the salary cap is too much.

The best modern teams in pretty much all team sports are filled with squads that have less one dimensional "role players" in their lineups, the skill gap and speed differences are narrowing from the best to the worst especially in the last 10-15yrs of team sports.

Sure role players will always exist but let's not over hype it's benefits especially in the modern game.

Post greatly edited down not to offend or come across too arrogant lol.

Sign up to my patreon page for more in-depth dribble.

You made some good points and Contribution to our forum as all feathered friends point of views do.

The brutal truth does offend but we must all make sure it is the truth that offends and not us Personally


The Complete defensive and Offensive super Impact Manly Lock forwards that can Conquer in any Era are Mal Reilly , Steve Norton and Ben Kennedy

 

[joshcooper123]

And when you are that one dimensional and respected too much for one element of the game you build a squad that is consistently middle of the road---especially when your impact on the salary cap is too much.

The best modern teams in pretty much all team sports are filled with squads that have less one dimensional "role players" in their lineups, the skill gap and speed differences are narrowing from the best to the worst especially in the last 10-15yrs of team sports.

Sure role players will always exist but let's not over hype it's benefits especially in the modern game.

Post greatly edited down not to offend or come across too arrogant lol.

Sign up to my patreon page for more in-depth dribble.

i think you should have a read of this from something i said on the manly way thread and how the way we use jake and our style of play.

after the talk with seibold i'm coming to realise that manly's way of playing the game will be different to most teams and also gives reason over our signings. the structure of the squad is that we have a really solid middle and tight middle with less mobile players to help strengthen stability like jake playing 80 in the middle croker playing close to 80. then we have a lot of strike with speed (him saying paulo for left wing) and skill outside on the edges which results in a lot of early ball to big resigning of schuster and olaka'ata. I feel schuster through this structure schuster will be given a lot of early ball this year and can use his play making skills as well as power game and desceptive passing. he won't be used as just another hit up forward and run tight lines.

like an example of this "style of footy" manly are looking to play is to gain enough ground through the middle forwards then spread it out to our powerful skillful backrowers or chuck it out to centres and wingers if there's an overlap. a contrasting clubs game plan would be parramatta and who evolve their game around 2nd phase play with offloads and beating teams through the middle. by doing this both teams are just playing to their strengths of what they have at the club, parra have 3 of the top 5 offloaders in the comp of hopgood, cartright and junior paulo and manly probaby have the fastest back 5 in the comp.

so if manly want to stay down this path for the future players like caleb navale who is almost a direct replica of jake through their style of game of runs for around 120m, tackles his guts off, can play long minutes and has a decent short passing game to start attacks needs to be in manlys mind of the future. i know both of these players may lack the "mobility and leg speed of a modern day lock" but for Manly's style of 13 Navale is a perfect mould into this team.

 

[Technical Coach]

Sorry mate but if that's not dribble, not sure what is (no offence intended!)

So if a player is both one dimensional and also respected, then the whole squad becomes average? What?? Does not a hooker have a specific "role" to do? Or should all players be servicing the ruck? Why don't we just swap halfback and prop from time to time?

(Btw, back to my original point, considering locks play 80min, why are none of them in the top 10 for metres gained? Only Yeoh and Carrigan make top 20, and only 2 more in top 50. I.e. less than 10% of NRL's biggest runners are locks)

When you combine Jakes status in the squad, his impact on the salary cap, the amount of times in the past decade he has had his hands on the ball in our attacking structures, his lack of having the occasional penetration through the middle line to at least keep the middle defenders honest all because he most certainly does keep the middle tight, plays high minutes and can help reduce the burden on our interchange bench then yeah you lean towards creating an average squad.

Not saying he doesn't offer quality in the defensive work rate elements while still producing 9-10 hitups under fatigue but that is also our problem, too often Manly(this past decade) is under fatigue attacking wise because our attacking structures and go forward have been poor and quality of depth in the squad and types of players on the books are average.

Nathan Hindmarsh was respected for his high work rate and we know where that story ends.

Hookers these days have halves like qualities and are more rounded than old school stand and deliver one dimensional hookers who just passed out of the ruck and offered good defensive numbers---they are role players with more attributes.

From the extended highlights i watched of last season(lacked interest in the game in general) it did appear Jake was less used in link plays but i might be wrong, which is a good thing. I saw a few positives in the back end of the year highlights along with DCE doing some really good things in taking on the line more and squaring up better, setting up his outside options in a more composed way.

All i can say is i mentioned from the outset i didn't like the structure or coaching mindset behind the "overuse" of Jake in link plays and that it wouldn't be good enough for future success and that viewpoint has held up as expected.

There is a 2nd part to this post but maybe another time.

 

[eaglebuzz]

Jake's biggest attribute is definitely his defence which is not only tight but painful for attacking players to experience, but I do miss his earlier career form where he bent the line almost at will and regularly made line breaks out of absolutely nowhere.

 

[sheridanstand78]

And when you are that one dimensional and respected too much for one element of the game you build a squad that is consistently middle of the road---especially when your impact on the salary cap is too much.

The best modern teams in pretty much all team sports are filled with squads that have less one dimensional "role players" in their lineups, the skill gap and speed differences are narrowing from the best to the worst especially in the last 10-15yrs of team sports.

Sure role players will always exist but let's not over hype it's benefits especially in the modern game.

Post greatly edited down not to offend or come across too arrogant lol.

Sign up to my patreon page for more in-depth dribble.

Seriously mate, you'd boo Santa Claus!

 

[Technical Coach]

Seriously mate, you'd boo Santa Claus!

And New Years also

 

[Pete W]

When you combine Jakes status in the squad, his impact on the salary cap, the amount of times in the past decade he has had his hands on the ball in our attacking structures, his lack of having the occasional penetration through the middle line to at least keep the middle defenders honest all because he most certainly does keep the middle tight, plays high minutes and can help reduce the burden on our interchange bench then yeah you lean towards creating an average squad.

Not saying he doesn't offer quality in the defensive work rate elements while still producing 9-10 hitups under fatigue but that is also our problem, too often Manly(this past decade) is under fatigue attacking wise because our attacking structures and go forward have been poor and quality of depth in the squad and types of players on the books are average.

Nathan Hindmarsh was respected for his high work rate and we know where that story ends.

Hookers these days have halves like qualities and are more rounded than old school stand and deliver one dimensional hookers who just passed out of the ruck and offered good defensive numbers---they are role players with more attributes.

From the extended highlights i watched of last season(lacked interest in the game in general) it did appear Jake was less used in link plays but i might be wrong, which is a good thing. I saw a few positives in the back end of the year highlights along with DCE doing some really good things in taking on the line more and squaring up better, setting up his outside options in a more composed way.

All i can say is i mentioned from the outset i didn't like the structure or coaching mindset behind the "overuse" of Jake in link plays and that it wouldn't be good enough for future success and that viewpoint has held up as expected.

There is a 2nd part to this post but maybe another time.

Certainly agree with all of this...

Although my observation has been that the deficiencies you refer to have been a result of poor recruitment, development and list management with regards to the remaining 70% of cap space available. Imo, if it weren't for Jake, Tom, and DCE (despite their respective faults), we could have easily picked up a spoon or two. Jake being a "role" player, even for his price tag, is not the reason Manly have been dogsh*t average this last decade

 

[Will on the hill]

And New Years also

I'm with you TC 24th of Dec - 2nd of Jan is way over hyped. 2nd of Feb till Australia Day is the best time of year, with the exception of September/October when Manly is still playing.

 

[Technical Coach]

I'm with you TC 24th of Dec - 2nd of Jan is way over hyped. 2nd of Feb till Australia Day is the best time of year, with the exception of September/October when Manly is still playing.

I don't mind Christmas it is New Years that is cheesy as fu..

 

[Tragic Eagle]

The squad they have assembled provides balance and depth. I believe we are only one gun front rower short. Great to see things are on the up. Lets hope this brings positive results on the field. I am looking forward to the 2024 season bring it on.

 

[SeaEagleRock8]

The squad they have assembled provides balance and depth. I believe we are only one gun front rower short. Great to see things are on the up. Lets hope this brings positive results on the field. I am looking forward to the 2024 season bring it on.

Noticed Sykes in some of the club promo clips, so must still be seen as a potential first grade front rower (presumably).